Companies Going Woke

[Danny]

9 hours ago, Spike said:

I bet I know the first question you asked him to

Can’t get me bollock back unfortunately 

[Spike]

2 hours ago, Tommy said:

No feet though. 

But then she gets those virgin feet which have never stepped on anything 

@MUFC

[Harry]

On 05/01/2024 at 05:24, Goku de la Boca said:

I am not a misogynist nor racist nor xenophonic yet I can see a certain agenda pushed against while males. Some people have lost the concept of "equal rights" and "entertainment" in order to push an agenda.

Alien, Rush Hour, etc, are examples of strong independent women or black protagonists that are not shoehorned in. So it's not that the public is racist or misogynist that we aren't supporting Disney movies, it's that we're tired of them making those agendas look worse and worse.

I think them hiring an activist as a director highlights that perfectly. It's fine to show progressive rights but Disney IMO are doing it the most obvious way possible that doesn't teach any moral rights.

What are your opinions?

What's an entertainment company to do in this increasingly polarised world that's wading deeper and deeper into culture wars issues than ever before?

Most likely they will continue to try to be as profitable as possible.

A company like Disney wants to maximise the appeal of its products to as wide of an audience as possible, so it's strongly not in their interests to put off a big chunk of potential viewers by being unnecessarily polarising. However it suits politicians and partisan media to discuss, magnify and inflame any divides and get people more and more passionate angry or excited about it.

And to a point it suits Disney if the plot/casting decision generates hype or attention and has more positive impact than negative on helping a film to achieve commercial success. But that will lead to them taking fairly safe positions like pro gun control, pro racial equality, etc. and any bigger risks if they are judged to have negatively impacted the films commercial impact are likely not to be repeated.

Seriously, wokeness in the entertainment industry is a very minor issue. My biggest concerns are about how shit movies are these days. Movies seem to be engineered assemblies of moments and scenes based on focus group feedback of What Viewers Want with a story written afterwards to tie it all together.  As opposed to a fluid story being turned into a film. 

 

[Harry]

On 05/01/2024 at 06:23, Dr. Gonzo said:

For instance, if the idea of Disney casting a black woman as Ariel in the Little Mermaid upset anyone... I know 100% that they are a racist. It's a fucking mermaid, why does the skin colour matter? It doesn't, it's just people being pissed off something they remember from their childhood is now depicting Ariel as someone they see as "lesser" - and they see her as lesser because they're racist. So then they say things like "Disney is woke" and "go woke, go broke" because otherwise what they'd want to say and tweet would probably include the n word and get them widespread condemnation.

I think there is nuance to people's reactions to a casting decision like that based on what they perceive the motive/context to be.

Did Disney pick this actress regardless of the colour of her skin, or did they pick her because of it?

One side is happy with the decision as perceived to be aligning with their view of what racial equality looks like. The other side is angered because in some cases they are white supremicists but for others it will be because they don't believe a decision by a film company to hire an actress "because she was black"  as opposed to "regardless of whether she was black or white" aligns with their view of what racial equality looks like.

The issue at heart of that is less about whether or not people support racial equality but rather whether or not affirmative action is aligned with racial equality or not.

But the discourse is so reductive, and uncivil that a genuine discussion of that issue never plays out.

[Dave]

On 05/01/2024 at 01:49, Dr. Gonzo said:

He’s trying to debate, you’re not engaging. It’s not really debate if you don’t address counterpoints the person you debate is making. Political debates by actual politicians done on TV are usually shit debates done for TV, but even politicians are expected to address the counterpoints to their arguments they’ve made.

Otherwise it’s just talking over someone, which you can’t really do on the internet lol - because people can call you out on it pretty easily.

[Goku de la Boca]

1 hour ago, The Palace Fan said:

I've answered the question you fucking melon, I just did it earlier.

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 hour ago, Goku de la Boca said:

I've answered the question you fucking melon, I just did it earlier.

Tbh no you still haven’t answered questions from me or Spike on this thread

[Goku de la Boca]

Just now, Dr. Gonzo said:

Tbh no you still haven’t answered questions from me or Spike on this thread

I did indirectly.

Quote

You’re very right I haven’t taken this that serious, I’ve been out all day and am a bit knackered. Maybe one day I’ll re-read this and give something new. I definitely appreciate the kind words and concerns though, I also consider you a friend.

You're asking too much to be honest, because I didn't take this debate as seriously as you two. I will answer it when I'm feeling more fresh and able to form proper arguments to something that isn't my specialty and is just a casual opinion. It's 3 AM here so definitely not good timing.

The Palace Fan posted a very unnecessarily provocation when I wasn't intentionally picking on anybody, just giving my 2 cents/

[Stan]

You say a lot about the topic you admit you're not that remotely interested in (let alone created). Perhaps you're just in denial that other people know more about it than you, and that's difficult for you to accept, verbally or not. 

Then hide behind the fact you just want to 'debate'.

[Goku de la Boca]

6 minutes ago, Stan said:

You say a lot about the topic you admit you're not that remotely interested in (let alone created). Perhaps you're just in denial that other people know more about it than you, and that's difficult for you to accept, verbally or not. 

Then hide behind the fact you just want to 'debate'.

I literally just said this 

33 minutes ago, Goku de la Boca said:

I will answer it when I'm feeling more fresh and able to form proper arguments to something that isn't my specialty and is just a casual opinion.

Stop trying to provoke me, christ. I am far and away not an expert on this topic but I have a pretty closed view because I don't think Disney is doing it in the right way. That doesn't mean I can't open a debate/

[Spike]

2 hours ago, Goku de la Boca said:

I literally just said this 

Stop trying to provoke me, christ. I am far and away not an expert on this topic but I have a pretty closed view because I don't think Disney is doing it in the right way. That doesn't mean I can't open a debate/

Having already decided to be a brick-wall is pretty counterintuitive to making a thread for a ‘debate’. And no you didn’t answer directly or indirectly any of our questions.

[Goku de la Boca]

Just now, Spike said:

Having already decided to be a brick-wall is pretty counterintuitive to making a thread for a ‘debate’. And no you didn’t answer directly or indirectly any of our questions.

It is true I have closed myself a bit here, but I think you 2 were more wound up about this topic than I was, with all due respect. Despite that I still enjoyed chatting in this thread. Apologies if it wasn't mutual

[Spike]

5 minutes ago, Goku de la Boca said:

It is true I have closed myself a bit here, but I think you 2 were more wound up about this topic than I was, with all due respect. Despite that I still enjoyed chatting in this thread. Apologies if it wasn't mutual

I wasn’t wound up about the topic at all, I was wound up that you were and still are repeating the sort of shit that Ben Shapiro says.

[Goku de la Boca]

Just now, Spike said:

I wasn’t wound up about the topic at all, I was wound up that you were and still are repeating the sort of shit that Ben Shapiro says.

Nah I wasn't wound up, on the contrary I enjoyed the discussion until the very end anyways where it felt more personal, but I was mostly out when it happened.

[Dr. Gonzo]

10 hours ago, Stan said:

You say a lot about the topic you admit you're not that remotely interested in (let alone created). Perhaps you're just in denial that other people know more about it than you, and that's difficult for you to accept, verbally or not. 

Then hide behind the fact you just want to 'debate'.

This, but also I don't understand the thought process in creating a thread in something you allegedly don't give a shit about.

It literally doesn't make any sense.

[Rucksackfranzose]

On 04/01/2024 at 22:23, Goku de la Boca said:

I expressed myself wrong. She was as you said, but they skip everything else in the remake. As for the little mermaid, there is a mention of her race. She’s a white mermaid, unless I am colourblind mate. I’m pretty sure she was white. And believe me movies that whitewash are just as bad as the other side, but it’s much less common with the big hitters at least.

 

Nope, there isn't. The original story, a fairy tale by Hans Christian Andersen, doesn't mention race with a single word. Of course you might argue a 19th century Danish author probably envisioned her white, still it isn't expressely mentioned and I'd counterargue that there are historical sources of European seamen mixing up sea lions, who're definitely brown, with mermaids.

Edited January 9 by Rucksackfranzose

[Azeem]

Remake of sleeping beauty but she is Colombian who is sleeping through her deportation. 

[Coma+]

I'm torn between Cicero thinking that Aquaman is Marvel and my desire to see Ryan Gosling in Obama.

[Goku de la Boca]

15 hours ago, Rucksackfranzose said:

Nope, there isn't. The original story, a fairy tale by Hans Christian Andersen, doesn't mention race with a single word. Of course you might argue a 19th century Danish author probably envisioned her white, still it isn't expressely mentioned and I'd counterargue that there are historical sources of European seamen mixing up sea lions, who're definitely brown, with mermaids.

That is very fair, it's just my uncultured side that did not know it was based on a fairy tale haha

[Stan]

3 hours ago, Goku de la Boca said:

That is very fair, it's just my uncultured side that did not know it was based on a fairy tale haha

Did you think mermaids were real ? 

[Tommy]

2 hours ago, Stan said:

Did you think mermaids were real ? 

They are. They live in Egypt, but definitely not in Africa. 

[Goku de la Boca]

19 minutes ago, Tommy said:

They are. They live in Egypt, but definitely not in Africa. 

They could live in Asia in Sinai. Nice try though.

[Dr. Gonzo]

I guess it's easier to respond to that than the questions @Spike and I asked 

[Spike]

24 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I guess it's easier to respond to that than the questions @Spike and I asked 

Damage control for Egypt was more important 

[Goku de la Boca]

58 minutes ago, Spike said:

Damage control for Egypt was more important 

There is no damage control - a bunch of people here fell for something years ago and keep biting on the hook. Kind of funny to be honest.