Coronavirus (COVID-19) Outbreak

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Russia, China, US, all as bad as each other. Britain would still be as bad if you were looking from the outside as well if we were still a major world power.

Yeah every super power is cunty.

Plus since the end of the 2nd world war we’ve held the US’s hand and showed them the ropes as they took to fucking the world up 

[Honey Honey]

1 minute ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Old populations and increasing obesity. The healthy east is fine, fat, decrepit west is struggling. It's no surprise. 

Japan and South Korea same age rates if not older.

[DeadLinesman]

Top 10 most obese countries are all east of Europe..........

[The Artful Dodger]

1 minute ago, Steve Bruce Almighty said:

Japan and South Korea same age rates if not older.

Yes and they look after older people properly there, unlike our country which shunt them off to care homes as soon as we can. This whole thing is a damning indictment of the West, and are still reacting. Absolutely no fortitude whatsoever, just blame and sorrow. I hope we never hear anything about the made up 'Blitz spirit' ever again.

[The Artful Dodger]

4 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

Top 10 most obese countries are all east of Europe..........

I don't know their COVID stats, do you? The UK is the most obsese country in Europe, we see old people as burdens and families refuse to look after their own old and put them in homes. I know people will refuse to look at ourselves but there is a lot we can learn. Our culture is part of the issue. Nobody will admit it though.

Edited December 22, 2020 by The Artful Dodger

[Honey Honey]

3 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Yes and they look after older people properly there, unlike our country which shunt them off to care homes as soon as we can. This whole thing is a damning indictment of the West, and are still reacting. Absolutely no fortitude whatsoever, just blame and sorrow. I hope we never hear anything about the made up 'Blitz spirit' ever again.

I agree we have everything to learn from the East, but the point I'm getting at is that the difference is the virus didn't go through their population. Not that the virus went through their population and they were just healthier. There's a reason it didn't go through it and that's what we have to learn. I don't think we can start to play the freedom request card when we haven't learned how to stop it spreading in the first place. 

[The Artful Dodger]

Might be controversial but I'll put this out there: the multi million business of care homes is a moral stain on this country. Only the most exceptional circumstances should an elderly person go to a car home, the family should take care of them. They looked after us as kids and we should look after them when they are old. It is the absolute epitome of Thatcherism that they are seen as annoying, dispensable people who we can lump off. I sincerely hope that if I have any children they love me enough not not to put me in a home, the most cruel fate for anyone. 

[RandoEFC+]

As much as I hate the blitz spirit thing and the shit attitude to personal health in the UK, there are huge cultural differences that you can't ignore. The measures taken by some of the Eastern countries to contain the virus simply aren't viable in Western countries. Some of them would laugh at what we call a "lockdown" compared to, say, the original Wuhan lockdown and there's no way you can get a South Korean style test and trace system running in a country like the UK where people think that their personal liberty and privacy come above a public health crisis - and to be fair, we don't have massive trust in governance in the West, often with good reason, so can you blame people for having this attitude?

What I will say is that the UK has become a country that feeds off of conflict and "otherism". Whether it be Muslims, immigrants, the EU, the public sector, the media in the UK has made it an art form turning the public against each other. Readers of the Mail and the Sun always have something to be angry at, someone to blame their lives on, and its never rich white men who inherited their wealth, have never genuinely worked for their position in life, pay their taxes overseas and get elected to run the country because of their posh accents and because they more or less look and sound like the ones that came before them and because of their upbringing, genuinely don't see why they should use their massive advantages to make other peoples' lives better at little or no cost to themselves. But I'm going to stop there before I go off on one properly.

[MUFC]

2 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Might be controversial but I'll put this out there: the multi million business of care homes is a moral stain on this country. Only the most exceptional circumstances should an elderly person go to a car home, the family should take care of them. They looked after us as kids and we should look after them when they are old. It is the absolute epitome of Thatcherism that they are seen as annoying, dispensable people who we can lump off. I sincerely hope that if I have any children they love me enough not not to put me in a home, the most cruel fate for anyone. 

As a Muslim, putting your parents in a care home is a huge sin.

Oh care homes.

Oh elderly.

Oh Pakistan.

[MUFC]

Could be more areas in UK going into tier 4 on Boxing Day.

[The Artful Dodger]

4 minutes ago, MUFC said:

As a Muslim, putting your parents in a care home is a huge sin.

Oh care homes.

Oh elderly.

Oh Pakistan.

Christian belief is similar, at its heart.

We've become so rooted in money and our own life that we just want the easiest solution. There are conditions which need care which the family can't provide I'm not trying to judge people here. It's what we encourage as a society. But I do think, as best we can, we should look after our family cradle to the grave. Having your loved ones around you when you are coming to the end can make such a difference.

Edited December 22, 2020 by The Artful Dodger

[The Artful Dodger]

10 minutes ago, Steve Bruce Almighty said:

I agree we have everything to learn from the East, but the point I'm getting at is that the difference is the virus didn't go through their population. Not that the virus went through their population and they were just healthier. There's a reason it didn't go through it and that's what we have to learn. I don't think we can start to play the freedom request card when we haven't learned how to stop it spreading in the first place. 

I 100% agree but now we're past the point of no return, where do we turn?

I am being unreasonably grumpy today, my Mum lives in Scotland and won't be travelling down for Christmas now. I know it's not the greatest sacrifice but just seems this year is never ending.

[DeadLinesman]

1 hour ago, The Artful Dodger said:

I 100% agree but now we're past the point of no return, where do we turn?

I am being unreasonably grumpy today, my Mum lives in Scotland and won't be travelling down for Christmas now. I know it's not the greatest sacrifice but just seems this year is never ending.

I think there’s a massive difference in what are for instance supported accommodation homes, resedential homes and care homes. My mum died in a nursing care bed in March riddled with cancer on a syringe driver. Couldn’t really expect family to look after someone who was that heavily dependent on nursing care. Same with end stage dementia. You can’t expect a family to look after someone 24/7 when they’ve got kids/jobs etc and don’t have the specialist facilities. 
 

My Mrs’ grandmother was in supported accommodation and said it was the best thing she ever did at 88. Got to play bingo everyday, sit with ladies her age and discuss interest and went on days out. 
 

Now of course, there is also the shite side where families simply stick relatives in when they can’t be arsed, but again there’s usually some form of capacity assessment before this is allowed. 

[carefreeluke]

4 hours ago, The Artful Dodger said:

Why aren't we doing everything to get vaccinations done asap? Get the army in, anyone who can help etc. It will be very expensive but lockdown till Easter will be far more damaging.

That's what I don't understand. The news of the vaccine was great but I was expecting it to be reaching far more than it has done so far, I know it's a big operation but surely given the priority this virus has for society, why haven't they done more? Or am I missing something?

[carefreeluke]

 

[The Artful Dodger]

57 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

I think there’s a massive difference in what are for instance supported accommodation homes, resedential homes and care homes. My mum died in a nursing care bed in March riddled with cancer on a syringe driver. Couldn’t really expect family to look after someone who was that heavily dependent on nursing care. Same with end stage dementia. You can’t expect a family to look after someone 24/7 when they’ve got kids/jobs etc and don’t have the specialist facilities. 
 

My Mrs’ grandmother was in supported accommodation and said it was the best thing she ever did at 88. Got to play bingo everyday, sit with ladies her age and discuss interest and went on days out. 
 

Now of course, there is also the shite side where families simply stick relatives in when they can’t be arsed, but again there’s usually some form of capacity assessment before this is allowed. 

It’s your last paragraph I’m talking about and I’m not trying to judge people. We live in a society which means we have no time, family is looked as peripheral rather than central to our lives. I think we should try and reverse this.

[Danny]

Is it really that common for people to stick elderly relatives in homes cos they cba?

[DeadLinesman]

1 hour ago, Danny said:

Is it really that common for people to stick elderly relatives in homes cos they cba?

More than you’d imagine. 

[Stan]

Quote

 

The AstraZeneca coronavirus vaccine could be approved by regulators just after Christmas, according to a medical scientist.

Professor Sir John Bell said he expects the vaccine - which has been developed by Oxford University researchers - to get the green light "pretty shortly".

He told the Today programme that the Medicines and Healthcare products Regulatory Agency (MHRA) has received "multiple sets of data" about the vaccine.

"So we are getting to be about prime time now, I would expect some news pretty shortly," he added.

"I doubt we'll make Christmas now, but just after Christmas I would expect.

"I have no concerns whatsoever that the data looks better than ever."

The government has ordered 100 million doses of the Oxford/AstraZeneca vaccine, with around 40 million to be made available by the end of March.

Approval of the vaccine would help boost the UK's battle against Covid-19 as it is easier to distribute than the Pfizer/BioNTech jab - which is currently being administered to certain groups across the UK.

 

 

[Stan]

Sturgeon's treatment in the media for a very brief blip of taking mask off at a funeral compared to how other rule-breaking MPs in England were treated tells you everything you need to know about the media in this country. In the absolute gutter. 

[Bluebird Hewitt]

11 minutes ago, Stan said:

Sturgeon's treatment in the media for a very brief blip of taking mask off at a funeral compared to how other rule-breaking MPs in England were treated tells you everything you need to know about the media in this country. In the absolute gutter. 

While I agree with how the media has been in general around this from all angles (left and right wing) and agree that this was nothing more than a brief blip, something like this isn't helpful when the leader of your country makes an error while telling the public they must do this or face fines. 

Also, @Inverted would be able to confirm this but I thought wakes were generally banned (I know it is with us now and I think it's the same in England as well). 

[Inverted]

3 minutes ago, Bluebird Hewitt said:

While I agree with how the media has been in general around this from all angles (left and right wing) and agree that this was nothing more than a brief blip, something like this isn't helpful when the leader of your country makes an error while telling the public they must do this or face fines. 

Also, @Inverted would be able to confirm this but I thought wakes were generally banned (I know it is with us now and I think it's the same in England as well). 

I would have guessed you wouldn’t be able to have one now, but apparently gatherings of a certain size within “hospitality venues” are fine up until after Christmas. 

Most people who are interested are only really making a deal out of the mask. I don’t think it is particularly sincere, either. 

[Bluebird Hewitt]

6 minutes ago, Inverted said:

I would have guessed you wouldn’t be able to have one now, but apparently gatherings of a certain size within “hospitality venues” are fine up until after Christmas. 

Most people who are interested are only really making a deal out of the mask. I don’t think it is particularly sincere, either. 

Ah ok, fair enough. I attended a funeral in England just over two weeks ago and there was no wake afterwards, so assumed it was a general ban as they're banned in Wales as well. 

[RandoEFC+]

Sake

[Stan]

21 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Sake

Is this surprising? We've heard over past few weeks especially that viruses mutate 100s and 1000s of times and this was almost to be expected.

I guess it's good they've quarantined 2 cases and contacts so far and we just have to hope there's no further cases found. 

 

I am surprised more areas aren't in Tier 4 though. Still remains in London, South East and now covers more surrounding areas i.e. Sussex, Oxfordshire, Cambridgeshire, Essex, Norfolk. Thought it'd go further west and towards the Midlands too.