Liverpool Discussion

[Cicero]

Agreed terms according to SKY. 3 year deal. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 hour ago, Cicero said:

Agreed terms according to SKY. 3 year deal. 

The Sky story is from Florian Plettenberg, who is really just a bullshit artist that makes Fabrizio Romano look like an actual journalist.

And according to Portuguese football fans that Pedro Sepulveda guy I quoted is also incredibly unreliable.

 

[OrangeKhrush]

Steven Gerrard's underwhelming performance in the Saudi league will put pay to any big jobs in Europe.   

[Dr. Gonzo]

10 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

Steven Gerrard's underwhelming performance in the Saudi league will put pay to any big jobs in Europe.   

He's never getting a big job in Europe again unless he makes a move to some midtable side and does well with them. He's gonna milk his stay in the desert getting paid more than most managers in Europe for as long as he can til he gets the sack.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Knee jerk reaction - but if we're looking at people that have a decent track record but not much to show in the way of winning things in a big league... Gasperini from Atalanta's got a history of doing well on a budget and he's clearly very good tactically.

[Mel81x+]

7 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Knee jerk reaction - but if we're looking at people that have a decent track record but not much to show in the way of winning things in a big league... Gasperini from Atalanta's got a history of doing well on a budget and he's clearly very good tactically.

Wasn't there talk we've approached someone from Portugal for the job?

[Rick]

8 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Knee jerk reaction - but if we're looking at people that have a decent track record but not much to show in the way of winning things in a big league... Gasperini from Atalanta's got a history of doing well on a budget and he's clearly very good tactically.

There’s knee jerk and then there’s this.  Thought I was bad Gonzo but bloody hell. 
 

I’m just going to take the rest of the season as it comes now. The last few weeks have shown nothing but regression from the side. Momentum has slowed right down, and I just don’t think that we go on a win run needed for the title. 

[CaaC (John)+]

When Fergie announced he was retiring at the end of season 2013 the players upped a gear and made sure he retired with a league title, it looks like, to me, the pool players have gone into the "Oh shit" mode and could not give a toss.  

I hope I am wrong as our son is a Liverpool supporter and I hope they win the league title for him.

[Danny]

3 hours ago, CaaC (John) said:

When Fergie announced he was retiring at the end of season 2013 the players upped a gear and made sure he retired with a league title, it looks like, to me, the pool players have gone into the "Oh shit" mode and could not give a toss.  

I hope I am wrong as our son is a Liverpool supporter and I hope they win the league title for him.

I think it also helped that United began the season by signing the Golden Boot winner from the previous season after losing out on a title due to goal difference.

Liverpool didn't expect to be competing for the title this season, the signings they made suggested they were building rather than the finished product. I think they've just probably overachieved a bit and don't have the squad to fight on multiple fronts like they've had in previous years.

[Stan]

Part of me wonders if they've had some kind of discussion (internally?) about priorities, and perhaps putting all the proverbial eggs in to the PL title basket, and not worrying about Europa League...

[Danny]

11 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Knee jerk reaction - but if we're looking at people that have a decent track record but not much to show in the way of winning things in a big league... Gasperini from Atalanta's got a history of doing well on a budget and he's clearly very good tactically.

I don't think it's a knee jerk reaction, Gasperini doesn't really get the credit he deserves outside of Italy, three 3rd place finishes in a row, two times runner up in the Coppa Italia. Doesn't really have the budget to compete with the likes of Juve, Inter, Roma, Milan etc but he still manages to in terms of top 4.

Initially when I made my post about potential replacements I did think about putting him in, but the list of maybe's generally included people who had won something. It would be a left field appointment but not necessarily a bad one.

Only thing I would say and this is why I didn't suggest him is previously Klopp was a very obvious appointment. It didn't take a lot of looking at underlying statistics to realise that appointing the man who broke Bayern's dominance with a low budget and great attacking football was going to be the best decision for Liverpool. I think the club will look for something or someone similar and Gasperini probably won't make it that far. But it wouldn't surprise me if they'd already had a good look at him

 

[CaaC (John)+]

1 minute ago, Danny said:

I think it also helped that United began the season by signing the Golden Boot winner from the previous season after losing out on a title due to goal difference.

I presume you mean R V Persie, he was a great player and when Fergie announced he was retiring Persie was gutted as he only joined United because he admired SAF as a manager.

RVP would have still been there after but a certain LV Gaal fucked him up from playing in the first team for some reason and Persie then left United.

[Danny]

1 minute ago, CaaC (John) said:

I presume you mean R V Persie, he was a great player and when Fergie announced he was retiring Persie was gutted as he only joined United because he admired SAF as a manager.

RVP would have still been there after but a certain LV Gaal fucked him up from playing in the first team for some reason and Persie then left United.

Yeah I meant van Persie.

I think there's been a lot of comparison of Klopp leaving Liverpool to United/Ferguson and Arsenal/Wenger but ultimately I don't think the scenarios are the same at all. Ferguson had a team that was beginning to age out and then had to deal with David Moyes who just wasn't equipped to manage players of that caliber. Wenger had already began to drive Arsenal out of the top 4 with a 5th and 6th place finish following a season where they couldn't keep up with Leicester.

This Liverpool team are in a title race whilst still being under construction, a lot of youth, players just settling in and still couple of key positions to fill in up front and in midfield. I don't think a new manager will have to do a lot to get the best out of them and they could get even better with a couple of bigger signings in the Summer.

[Stan]

27 minutes ago, Danny said:

This Liverpool team are in a title race whilst still being under construction, a lot of youth, players just settling in and still couple of key positions to fill in up front and in midfield. I don't think a new manager will have to do a lot to get the best out of them and they could get even better with a couple of bigger signings in the Summer.

You wonder if some big players may leave? Van Dijk, Salah, Alexander-Arnold perhaps? Maybe not all 3, but with Klopp going, anything could happen. 

[Danny]

7 minutes ago, Stan said:

You wonder if some big players may leave? Van Dijk, Salah, Alexander-Arnold perhaps? Maybe not all 3, but with Klopp going, anything could happen. 

I'd be surprised if they let 2/3 of them go...but one could definitely. You'd think Trent would want to stick around to see if he can help push on for silverware, and tbh I'm not sure anyone can actually afford him at this point. Van Dijk and Salah...I feel like Van Dijk would see another season and then probably leave...who knows with Salah

[CaaC (John)+]

28 minutes ago, Danny said:

Ferguson had a team that was beginning to age out and then had to deal with David Moyes

For the life of me, I cannot understand why Fergie chose Moyes as his successor, maybe from what I saw at the time Fergie had left a message with Jose M to give him a call about taking over from him but Jose never returned the call so Fergie went for Moyes.

Fergie told Moyes to be your own man but don't do it all at once; take your time and leave things the way they are before you change things.

But Moyes fucked that advice up and did a clean sweep and chose his own boot and backroom boys and went his own ways and that was his downfall big time.

[MUFC]

Are Real after Trent? Also a story that Reals president wants to speak to Garnacho next week.

[MUFC]

59 minutes ago, CaaC (John) said:

For the life of me, I cannot understand why Fergie chose Moyes as his successor, maybe from what I saw at the time Fergie had left a message with Jose M to give him a call about taking over from him but Jose never returned the call so Fergie went for Moyes.

Fergie told Moyes to be your own man but don't do it all at once; take your time and leave things the way they are before you change things.

But Moyes fucked that advice up and did a clean sweep and chose his own boot and backroom boys and went his own ways and that was his downfall big time.

He also told Rio to take a leaf out of Phil fucking Jagielkas book.

[Dr. Gonzo]

5 hours ago, Rick said:

There’s knee jerk and then there’s this.  Thought I was bad Gonzo but bloody hell. 
 

I’m just going to take the rest of the season as it comes now. The last few weeks have shown nothing but regression from the side. Momentum has slowed right down, and I just don’t think that we go on a win run needed for the title. 

He’s not that bad he’s had Atalanta punching above their weight for years

[Rick]

3 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

He’s not that bad he’s had Atalanta punching above their weight for years

Oh I fully agree, he’s an impressive coach. But I think the club are looking at the young up and coming type of manager. 
 

But if you asked me who I’d prefer out of Gasparini & DiZerbi, I wouldn’t be fast to make a decision on the younger man. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

33 minutes ago, Rick said:

Oh I fully agree, he’s an impressive coach. But I think the club are looking at the young up and coming type of manager. 
 

But if you asked me who I’d prefer out of Gasparini & DiZerbi, I wouldn’t be fast to make a decision on the younger man. 

The one negative (imo) about Gasperini is the one time he was at a big club he failed big time. So he might be Hodgson-esque, where he's not a bad manager by any means... but once he's in a role where the pressure is seriously on to deliver, he's not the best guy for the job.

Imo I'm not sure age should be a consideration for who to appoint. A young up and coming type of manager is good in that they might have a better idea of how to do things in this modern era of football compared to say Mourinho. But I wouldn't say managers with some experience are necessarily dinosaurs tactically - I think Gasperini at 66 with Atalanta over the last few years proves that pretty emphatically. Or Ancelotti at Madrid.

The real consideration should be who's going to have us in the best possible position in 3 years, which is likely going to be the length of their contract when they sign with us. If that's a younger up and comer, great - more chance for them to sign an extension and stay with us for a considerable amount of time. If that's someone older where we might be needing a new manager again in 3 years, but they delivered over those 3 years... that's fine by me too. But after so many wasted years in transition and us suddenly finding ourselves in a season where we unexpectedly are competing for a league title - I think the goal should be bringing in someone to keep that as the standard for the next 3 years.

My worry with a younger manager is, for any new manager a first season is always a transitional season and expectations should be tempered. I do worry that those without as much experience might have to do some learning on the job that makes the transitional period last a bit longer. Having said that, Xabi Alonso at Leverkusen seems to be doing fine despite the fact that Bayern I think are statistically having a better season than they had last year. So maybe I'm just too apprehensive of someone without experience under pressure due to that time with Rodgers.

[Cicero]

Amorim unlikely according to Ornstein 

[Danny]

On 12/04/2024 at 17:53, Dr. Gonzo said:

The one negative (imo) about Gasperini is the one time he was at a big club he failed big time. So he might be Hodgson-esque, where he's not a bad manager by any means... but once he's in a role where the pressure is seriously on to deliver, he's not the best guy for the job.

Imo I'm not sure age should be a consideration for who to appoint. A young up and coming type of manager is good in that they might have a better idea of how to do things in this modern era of football compared to say Mourinho. But I wouldn't say managers with some experience are necessarily dinosaurs tactically - I think Gasperini at 66 with Atalanta over the last few years proves that pretty emphatically. Or Ancelotti at Madrid.

The real consideration should be who's going to have us in the best possible position in 3 years, which is likely going to be the length of their contract when they sign with us. If that's a younger up and comer, great - more chance for them to sign an extension and stay with us for a considerable amount of time. If that's someone older where we might be needing a new manager again in 3 years, but they delivered over those 3 years... that's fine by me too. But after so many wasted years in transition and us suddenly finding ourselves in a season where we unexpectedly are competing for a league title - I think the goal should be bringing in someone to keep that as the standard for the next 3 years.

My worry with a younger manager is, for any new manager a first season is always a transitional season and expectations should be tempered. I do worry that those without as much experience might have to do some learning on the job that makes the transitional period last a bit longer. Having said that, Xabi Alonso at Leverkusen seems to be doing fine despite the fact that Bayern I think are statistically having a better season than they had last year. So maybe I'm just too apprehensive of someone without experience under pressure due to that time with Rodgers.

Judging purely off the words of James Horncastle, I can only imagine him leaving Atalanta if he can be offered serious assurances that he will be backed at Inter. I also think in England we have a very rigid view on managers and players. If they make it here they're great, if they struggle they're shit, if someone does a bad job they'll never be good enough etc.

But we've seen with Leicester City alone that two managers who were written off were able to win major trophies. Look at Ancelotti at Madrid, he was written off as a manager not too long ago as someone who underachieves and now he's dominating Spain and could well win another Champions League.

Edited April 22 by Danny

[Happy Blue]

37 minutes ago, Cicero said:

Amorim unlikely according to Ornstein 

They going to end up with Tuchel at this rate or O'Neil

[Dr. Gonzo]

1 hour ago, Danny said:

Judging purely off the words of James Horncastle, I can only imagine him leaving Atalanta if he can be offered serious assurances that he will be backed at Inter. I also think in England we have a very rigid view on managers and players. If they make it here they're great, if they struggle they're shit, if someone does a bad job they'll never be good enough etc.

But we've seen with Leicester City alone that two managers who were written off were able to win major trophies. Look at Ancelotti at Madrid, he was written off as a manager not too long ago as someone who underachieves and now he's dominating Spain and could well win another Champions League.

Tbf Ancelotti went from Everton, with a squad that on paper was going to always struggle imo, to Real Madrid with a squad that's used to winning the CL almost every year. And honestly I think people who wrote Ancelotti off probably don't know a whole lot about football, he's been one of the best in the business for a long time. And honestly, he did pretty well with Everton all things considered up until about the tail end of his last season there... when the wheels just came off and honestly never really looked like coming back on until Dyche steadied the ship a bit (and even he has come under pressure this season, despite working with his hands tied behind his back financially and has also been up against point deductions).

But realistically, I don't think Gasperini's going to be our next manager. I think @Rick is right, FGS wants someone younger in imo.

Idk how Gasperini was backed when he was at Inter, but by all accounts I would assume Inter would (even in their most skint seasons) be bigger spenders than Atalanta... so I don't think him having a history of failing when at a big club is that great despite how much he's been able to do to demonstrate he's a good manager since leaving Inter. I think it's something that has to be considered with a big job like ours: how have you been able to perform at a club with higher expectations than most. I think that's probably why Amorim or Inzaghi are two names that have been given the most serious consideration by our reputable journos now that Alonso is out of the picture.

But I also think our reputable journos are also just taking shots in the dark. By all accounts, we've got a pretty long shortlist drawn up with various names of potential managers... but no interviews are going to be conducted until we've got our new DoF in place (which won't be until the summer) and at the moment there's no clear favourites.