What is a "real fan"?

[Smiley Culture]

Linked to the "do you leave games early?" thread, what is your definition of a real fan?

[HK85]

Every one who takes a decent interest. 

Someone who is fortunate enough to go every week is no more or less a fan than an American who doesn't have the chance. 

[Danny]

I've said this before but if you're not from the area or don't have a connection to the club then you're not. It's just not possible, football clubs were made to represent an area, professionalism may have kicked in and capitalism may have put the sport on every tv screen around the world but MANCHESTER United will always be a Mancunians team. There are exceptions, my best mate is from London but his dad is from Manchester, half his family are and his family worked at the club so there is his connection.

I like South Sydney Rabbitoes (NRL) and Pitsburgh Steelers but I would never claim to be a supporter of a Sydney/Pittsburgh based side when I'm from west London. There's a reason towns and cities aren't in the clubs names.

Having said that I'm sure there are people who won't view me as a proper supporter because I "swapped" but that is life and much like the Yanks and Aussies who reckon they're Liverpool and United fans, I couldn't care less.

[nudge+]

Don't really care about this topic as I don't take football seriously anymore and I think the whole "who is a bigger fan" competition is just childish either way, but I'd certainly disagree with that. I'd say someone who spends money to attend matches every weekend and is present at the stadium to actually support the team is definitely more involved - both emotionally and financially - than someone watching matches on tele or online stream thousands of kilometers away (and maybe buys some merchandise here and there). The key thing for me is identification with the area, the club,  and what it represents, and the way I see it, local match-attending fans are always going to be the backbone of any club.

[Guest]

Its harsh to call anyone a plastic fan to be honest. One of my buddies from high school was a completely deluded Man United and I didn't like talking football with him. He didn't know much about the club history and really only knew about the recent squads or teams since he started following football. That doesn't make him any less of a real fan then the Glazers for fucks sake. He was interested in the club and that's all that really mattered. Being a real football fan and a real club fan is different.

The English have their own way of thinking, they can consider themselves real fans all they want because they invest to go to the games and travel across the country to watch their team play. That doesn't make them "real fans". It doesn't have to be that drastic. I see a difference between real fans and locals. At the end of the day, we are in a different generation and people in the UK will have to accept that clubs see more importance in marketing these days. Shirt sales and TV revenue all helps them. 

To support the above, there is also the family argument. What is there is a family that have traditionally supported lets say Palmeiras, then moved to a different country due to the economic problems in Brazil, had a child and passed on the supporting torch to them. When I was in Canada, I tried to move back to Peru for a long time and couldn't due to age. I still supported Universitario and showed interest, watched the games but didn't have a chance to go to the games due to being on the other part of the world. That doesn't mean I'm not a real fan. 

Sometimes I think some people need to grow up in terms of this. Its such an inneccesarily sensitive topic and it doesn't need to be. People can support whoever they want because its nature that chooses your team. Some people don't even have local clubs. 

Its a great feeling to be at the ground with all the other fans, celebrate the goals, the wins and the championships, but ultimately its not communism. People can choose who they want and then its up to them how they choose to support them.

[Inverted]

I think people should be left in peace with the clubs they support unless they're a truly flagrant plastic - and real-life examples of that kind of glory-hunting keyboard warrior are actually pretty rare. 

Like in high school I remember one boy, who wasn't extremely into football but tried to chat about it now and then, switched from Rangers to Celtic over time just as their fortunes starting to turn for the worst 

That's the kinda exceptional circumstance where I'd say piss should be taken.

[Honey Honey]

All fans choose the club they support on the basis of fashion.

In areas where the local club is shit it is essential to treat the nationally fashionable clubs non-local fans as a threat, the TV clubs, the trophy clubs, to devalue the worth of supporting them as to put others off doing so and ensure the fashionable thing to do is go local. Without that the local club would not have any support, there would be no status in supporting anyone but the top clubs, the trophy clubs, and so no fashionable element. Local fans have to reinforce qualities about themselves that the trophy clubs cannot, such as loyalty and match going, it keeps the whole game alive from the threat to the entire sport created by television.

Degrading glory hunters does work as a defence of the local club because it makes it unfashionable to support Man Utd, long may it continue.

[RandoEFC+]

On 29/11/2017 at 0:46 PM, Inverted said:

I think people should be left in peace with the clubs they support unless they're a truly flagrant plastic - and real-life examples of that kind of glory-hunting keyboard warrior are actually pretty rare. 

Like in high school I remember one boy, who wasn't extremely into football but tried to chat about it now and then, switched from Rangers to Celtic over time just as their fortunes starting to turn for the worst 

That's the kinda exceptional circumstance where I'd say piss should be taken.

This. We've been having this debate for at least five years since I first came across Kel on TFF.

I was born on the Isle of Man and I now live on the Isle of Man so obviously I can't go to games but I still plan most of my weekends around making sure I can watch the Everton game and I still scream like I did last night when we score and it still ruins my weekend when we lose so I will laugh in anyone's face who tries to tell me I'm not a real supporter just because I was born in a particular place.

It's boring how rattled people get about what a 'real fan' is. Fine if you think I'm less of a fan because I'm not from Liverpool. Move on from it, or would you respect me more if I stopped supporting Everton because someone on the internet I've never met said I can't support them because I'm not a Scouser?

[Rafa Beneathus]

I have been immature in the past on TFF, digging people out and accusing them of not being real fans, or being plastic cunts was more likely the terminology that I opted for.

At the end of the day you can support whatever club you want, people pick clubs to support because there are none local to them, at the end of the day should they just not be allowed to follow football? 

I am a believer though that you either get it or you don't. It isn't all about going to matches or travelling the country watching your team. It is about what it means when you win and how much it hurts when things are going awfully. For example I was at Old Trafford a fortnight a go, we took the lead and it was like being on cloud 9, absolute bedlam, literally felt in top of the world. The other night we scored a late equaliser after being 2-0 down to West Brom. Not even a huge game or a hard game but literally all of my problems in life were forgotten for the short period of time after the goal went in. 

And then an example of the opposite is when we drew 1-1 with Leeds on Good Friday, battered them and then conceded a last minute equaliser. Felt like being stabbed through the heart. Literally did feel like the world was over and that we had fucked up the promotion. I was being an absolute drama queen looking back but in the heat of the moment the extremes of football are ridiculous.

You either feel like that or you don't. Whether it makes you a real fan if you don't invest that much emotion into your club or not I don't know. But if you don't witness that high or that low pretty much every week you are missing out.

[Spike]

Someone that likes the team from the first day until the last.

On 11/29/2017 at 4:43 AM, Danny said:

I've said this before but if you're not from the area or don't have a connection to the club then you're not. It's just not possible, football clubs were made to represent an area, professionalism may have kicked in and capitalism may have put the sport on every tv screen around the world but MANCHESTER United will always be a Mancunians team. There are exceptions, my best mate is from London but his dad is from Manchester, half his family are and his family worked at the club so there is his connection.

I like South Sydney Rabbitoes (NRL) and Pitsburgh Steelers but I would never claim to be a supporter of a Sydney/Pittsburgh based side when I'm from west London. There's a reason towns and cities aren't in the clubs names.

Having said that I'm sure there are people who won't view me as a proper supporter because I "swapped" but that is life and much like the Yanks and Aussies who reckon they're Liverpool and United fans, I couldn't care less.

I'm from Australia and I'm 100% a supporter of the Chicago Blackhawks and the Chicago Cubs. Why can't I be a part of the Chicago community just because I'm not 'from here'? Why can't I integrate and assimilate into society? I'd definitely say you're a South-Sydney fan despite being from west-London. It is really only you English that are so overly obsessed with where you are from.

[Danny]

37 minutes ago, Spike said:

Someone that likes the team from the first day until the last.

I'm from Australia and I'm 100% a supporter of the Chicago Blackhawks and the Chicago Cubs. Why can't I be a part of the Chicago community just because I'm not 'from here'? Why can't I integrate and assimilate into society? I'd definitely say you're a South-Sydney fan despite being from west-London. It is really only you English that are so overly obsessed with where you are from.

I like the Rabbitohs but it wouldn't ruin my day if they've lost. Though it does help that I've lived here.

My granddad left Ireland at 18, worked around the UK and settled on QPR because because him and his pals would all go there. He's been a season ticket hold mostly ever since. I'd say that's a a fair reason to class him as a supporter.

Which is like you, you've moved to Chicago. Australian doesn't have NFL/NBA/NHL/MBL, much like the south of England doesn't  really have Rugby League. If I were staying here I'd probably invest more in the Rabbitohs, but I won't. That is however majorly different to one day deciding you'll support a team you have no connection to whatsoever.

[Dan+]

I'll never be able to grasp how someone can ferociously support a club with no real connection to them. It happens and it's their choice but I'll never understand it. 

[Spike]

1 hour ago, Dan said:

I'll never be able to grasp how someone can ferociously support a club with no real connection to them. It happens and it's their choice but I'll never understand it. 

But that is the semantics of it. Nobody said 'ferociously support', just support. There are varying degrees. 

[Guest]

14 minutes ago, Spike said:

But that is the semantics of it. Nobody said 'ferociously support', just support. There are varying degrees. 

Never argue with the English about how to support a club. According to them they know all.

[Machado]

On 29/11/2017 at 0:46 PM, Inverted said:

I think people should be left in peace with the clubs they support unless they're a truly flagrant plastic - and real-life examples of that kind of glory-hunting keyboard warrior are actually pretty rare. 

[Honey Honey]

1 hour ago, Blue said:

Never argue with the English about how to support a club. According to them they know all.

That makes no sense. Dan said he would never understand it so how can he be a know it all? I think you are using English nationality as a reason to deligitimise opinions you don't want to hear.

The whole thing isn't rocket science though, if people thought there was nothing special about supporting their local team why would anyone waste time and money on a club that is shit relative to the best? They'd want their heads checking if they did. 

When local supporters say supporting your local club and community matters they are pretty much telling you why they are loyal to the club they are. It is ironic to say each to their own but not if you support your club because you're local, we can only support a club for a reason everyone can choose such as liking the colour of the kit aged 8 

Imagine what would happen to the attendances in the football league without the idea that being local or being submissive to the local culture is worth something.

If you aren't a local fan then your goal should be to become an adopted member of the local community, otherwise don't bother asking to be called a real fan. The whole point of a clubs existence is its place in the local community, not its spot on prime time tv.

[Danny]

56 minutes ago, Kitchen Sales said:

That makes no sense. Dan said he would never understand it so how can he be a know it all? I think you are using English nationality as a reason to deligitimise opinions you don't want to hear.

The whole thing isn't rocket science though, if people thought there was nothing special about supporting their local team why would anyone waste time and money on a club that is shit relative to the best? They'd want their heads checking if they did. 

When local supporters say supporting your local club and community matters they are pretty much telling you why they are loyal to the club they are. It is ironic to say each to their own but not if you support your club because you're local, we can only support a club for a reason everyone can choose such as liking the colour of the kit aged 8 

Imagine what would happen to the attendances in the football league without the idea that being local or being submissive to the local culture is worth something.

If you aren't a local fan then your goal should be to become an adopted member of the local community, otherwise don't bother asking to be called a real fan. The whole point of a clubs existence is its place in the local community, not its spot on prime time tv.

Or we could all just support the European super league and forget anyone exists out of the Mega big clubs

[Honey Honey]

5 minutes ago, Danny said:

Or we could all just support the European super league and forget anyone exists out of the Mega big clubs

May as well just turn the big clubs into globe trotters and call it a day with football as we know it. The only people who watch Carlisle United should be the players parents.

[Dave]

To me a real fan is somebody that doesn't wear all black, hides behind a facemask, takes flares in to the ground, takes noise blasters and sets them off just before their team is about to take a corner, imply there was no atmosphere before they arrived, and force there way in to a ground without a ticket at the expense of men, women and children who support the same club who have paid tickets and end up missing the game because of their selfishness. Not that I'm referring to any group in particular of course.

[The Artful Dodger]

7 hours ago, Spike said:

But that is the semantics of it. Nobody said 'ferociously support', just support. There are varying degrees. 

Support indicates some sort of meaningful interaction with the club, which is only attending games as far I'm concerned. 

An interested third party is all anyone who doesn't go to the game but claims 'support'. I include myself in that, as former season ticket holder I can't count myself as a proper fan anymore as I don't regularly attend. Clubs were born from and represent their local community, nobody else. There's no issue with people from outside Manchester or Liverpoolm supporting Manchester United or Liverpool, they're just not really what that club is about or who they were formed for.

[SirBalon]

Everyone knows my view on this and the fact that clubs (the big ones) have lost their local identity or better said, they couldn't give two hoots about the local area anymore and I know this having lived in Highbury all of my life. Arsenal FC were forced to regenerate the area where The Emirates was built because it was either that or move out of Islington. They regenerated it and not they're land owners and property developers as well as a multinational football club. Practically none of the thousands of properties they've been involve in building or developing have gone to social housing for local people and what was once the old Highbury was turned into luxury flats.

I'm talking about Arsenal and I am sure much of the same can be said about many other big clubs everywhere... So with this, why should "fans" be expected to be seen as fans because they go to the games and show some sort of unbreakable loyalty to the club in the form of unconditional support?  That support I'm referring to comes in the shape purchasing season tickets... Support nowadays in this global football we now live in can vary in the way it manifests itself and if we are quick to accept foreign investment in our football clubs which then become everything other than local, then we have to accept that all fans can be sitting in their living room, bars or pubs anywhere on the planet.

[Azeem]

I have the same thinking on these matters like most English people here. Most of us Asians don't really follow the club, we follow the league through that club. Let's say a big club gets relegated, do you think all these Asian man utd supporters will see Manchester United v Leeds in the Championship rather than Arsenal v Chelsea in the Premier League? same goes for the Barca and Real fans after some time they will get a 'new favorite club'.

And one thing is completely unacceptable for me is that when someone cares more about some foreign club then his/her national team. When a Dortmund fan from Dortmund says he/she enjoys Dortmund winning more then Germany then i get that, football is that way but when someone from countries like USA,Bosnia,Poland etc say that they care more about Bayen,Barca,United etc more than their national team then that is complete nonsense for me.     

[Guest]

On 11/29/2017 at 0:28 PM, Blue said:

Its harsh to call anyone a plastic fan to be honest. One of my buddies from high school was a completely deluded Man United and I didn't like talking football with him. He didn't know much about the club history and really only knew about the recent squads or teams since he started following football. That doesn't make him any less of a real fan then the Glazers for fucks sake. He was interested in the club and that's all that really mattered. Being a real football fan and a real club fan is different.

The English have their own way of thinking, they can consider themselves real fans all they want because they invest to go to the games and travel across the country to watch their team play. That doesn't make them "real fans". It doesn't have to be that drastic. I see a difference between real fans and locals. At the end of the day, we are in a different generation and people in the UK will have to accept that clubs see more importance in marketing these days. Shirt sales and TV revenue all helps them. 

To support the above, there is also the family argument. What is there is a family that have traditionally supported lets say Palmeiras, then moved to a different country due to the economic problems in Brazil, had a child and passed on the supporting torch to them. When I was in Canada, I tried to move back to Peru for a long time and couldn't due to age. I still supported Universitario and showed interest, watched the games but didn't have a chance to go to the games due to being on the other part of the world. That doesn't mean I'm not a real fan. 

Sometimes I think some people need to grow up in terms of this. Its such an inneccesarily sensitive topic and it doesn't need to be. People can support whoever they want because its nature that chooses your team. Some people don't even have local clubs. 

Its a great feeling to be at the ground with all the other fans, celebrate the goals, the wins and the championships, but ultimately its not communism. People can choose who they want and then its up to them how they choose to support them.

We're not all like Dan you know I don't think you can really say what a real fan is. We're all pretty tame by John Portsmouth's standards. Football is entertainment. If people don't like football they don't support it.  Nobody has an obligation to support their local club you can support who you want and you can go to a game when you want. It isn't anyone else's place to tell people who to support or tell them they are not a real fan.

[Spike]

On 12/1/2017 at 4:50 AM, The Artful Dodger said:

Support indicates some sort of meaningful interaction with the club, which is only attending games as far I'm concerned. 

An interested third party is all anyone who doesn't go to the game but claims 'support'. I include myself in that, as former season ticket holder I can't count myself as a proper fan anymore as I don't regularly attend. Clubs were born from and represent their local community, nobody else. There's no issue with people from outside Manchester or Liverpoolm supporting Manchester United or Liverpool, they're just not really what that club is about or who they were formed for.

What about people that can't afford tickets?

[SirBalon]

34 minutes ago, Spike said:

What about people that can't afford tickets?

That's why if you consider yourself an Arsenal fan you're in the club mate. You chose the wrong football club!

Look at Prince Harry... The only reason a man gets hitched is because he can no longer afford to support his team.