Everton Discussion

[RandoEFC+]

There was definitely some impact with the Usmanov/sanctions situation. How much that all has to do with our financial situation, Moshiri trying to sell up, etc. Impossible to know as usual when you get into all of this dark money stuff. Neither of them are particularly savoury characters, clearly.

[Dr. Gonzo]

19 minutes ago, Whiskey said:

We were funded by Usmanov, Moshiri was merely a figurehead. Since the Russian sanctions came into play, it's shown how "little" money Moshiri has compared to what he technically has. He's obviously very wealthy but not on the mass billionaire scale that was initially believed. 

It's rumoured that it was all a bit of a money laundering exercise. I don't know 100% the ins and outs but it's been reported there's tons of shady deals between the two moving money, property, assets etc around between themselves.

I mean, Moshiri's invested pretty heavily in Usmanov's mining businesses - so I do think he has genuine wealth (not as much as Usmanov though), but sanctions are going to have that money frozen a bit. His other ventures I think would have him as "just a multimillionaire" () - but his ties to Usmanov push him up to a billionaire I think.

But I think he doesn't have access to a lot of his money right now due to those ties with Russian industries & oligarchs. If an auditor isn't willing to sign off on financial reports, I think that would lend credence to those money laundering rumours though.

[Spike]

4 hours ago, Whiskey said:

We were funded by Usmanov, Moshiri was merely a figurehead. Since the Russian sanctions came into play, it's shown how "little" money Moshiri has compared to what he technically has. He's obviously very wealthy but not on the mass billionaire scale that was initially believed. 

It's rumoured that it was all a bit of a money laundering exercise. I don't know 100% the ins and outs but it's been reported there's tons of shady deals between the two moving money, property, assets etc around between themselves.

 

4 hours ago, RandoEFC said:

There was definitely some impact with the Usmanov/sanctions situation. How much that all has to do with our financial situation, Moshiri trying to sell up, etc. Impossible to know as usual when you get into all of this dark money stuff. Neither of them are particularly savoury characters, clearly.

I’m sorry to hear this mates, I really empathise with you guys having something that is meant to be representative of a community reduced to something as cynical as money laundering. It isn’t right and it’s a shame that not much can be done to force the idea of clubs being owned by fans as members. I really hate it.

Do you think there would ever be something like Wimbledon FC movement in Liverpool/Merseyside

[Danny]

At what point do you look at sacking Lampard?

Obviously you’ve had years of mismanagement and he is unfortunate to have to deal with that, but he did get the chance to make a number of signings in the Summer to try and reshape the team.

At no point have I seen Everton look like a team isn’t in a relegation scrap under him.

[Gunnersaurus]

8 hours ago, Danny said:

At what point do you look at sacking Lampard?

Obviously you’ve had years of mismanagement and he is unfortunate to have to deal with that, but he did get the chance to make a number of signings in the Summer to try and reshape the team.

At no point have I seen Everton look like a team isn’t in a relegation scrap under him.

Generally I think give managers time but I don't think he will improve them. I could be wrong but its a big risk for them. Postecoglou is the favourite to replace Lampard apparently with pochettino second favourite. If I'm an Everton fan I definitely want pochettino. Postecoglou has done well at Celtic but the Scottish league isn't the premier league. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

20 minutes ago, Gunnersaurus said:

Generally I think give managers time but I don't think he will improve them. I could be wrong but its a big risk for them. Postecoglou is the favourite to replace Lampard apparently with pochettino second favourite. If I'm an Everton fan I definitely want pochettino. Postecoglou has done well at Celtic but the Scottish league isn't the premier league. 

@Rab would probably love the fume from Celtic fans if they lost another manager to another premier league club mid season though.

[RandoEFC+]

Lampard's record is actually awful for a modern Everton manager. Made to look less awful because his predecessor had a similar record.

I wouldn't want us to sack him though for another loose cannon like Martinez or someone with no Premier League experience. I feel like you go with a Sean Dyche type where you know there's a glass ceiling to what you can achieve but at least you know more or less what you're getting. I'd trust Dyche to get 14th-16th with what we've got in the squad. It's not great though is it.

Bottom line is now though that Lampard's position has to be open to review. It's not good enough so far this season.

[Rab]

12 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

@Rab would probably love the fume from Celtic fans if they lost another manager to another premier league club mid season though.

I think it's only natural to enjoy your rivals losing a key player/staff member.

12 hours ago, Gunnersaurus said:

Generally I think give managers time but I don't think he will improve them. I could be wrong but its a big risk for them. Postecoglou is the favourite to replace Lampard apparently with pochettino second favourite. If I'm an Everton fan I definitely want pochettino. Postecoglou has done well at Celtic but the Scottish league isn't the premier league. 

Yeah, just need to look at Alex Ferguson, him moving to England was a complete shambles.

[MUFC]

[Dr. Gonzo]

18 hours ago, RandoEFC said:

Lampard's record is actually awful for a modern Everton manager. Made to look less awful because his predecessor had a similar record.

I wouldn't want us to sack him though for another loose cannon like Martinez or someone with no Premier League experience. I feel like you go with a Sean Dyche type where you know there's a glass ceiling to what you can achieve but at least you know more or less what you're getting. I'd trust Dyche to get 14th-16th with what we've got in the squad. It's not great though is it.

Bottom line is now though that Lampard's position has to be open to review. It's not good enough so far this season.

Tbf to Dyche he has said he'd probably play differently if he had more money to work with in the transfer market - who knows if that's actually true or not, but I suspect he's hoping he one day gets the chance. I think he's a pretty good manager tbh and I'd be interested to see what he could do with a side with more money. I think he's a Liverpool fan though so I'm not sure how keen he'd be on managing Everton... but who knows, I'm sure he's been waiting for the chance to be a manager in the prem again and it's not like Everton will pay poorly.

I think if Dyche or Pochetino are open to the job, Everton would be insane to stick with Lampard.

[RandoEFC+]

16 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I think he's a Liverpool fan though so I'm not sure how keen he'd be on managing Everton.

I don't think these things really play into it. He's always made respectful comments about Everton in that way where managers try to express an interest without saying it out loud. Benitez came after all...

[OrangeKhrush]

On 28/12/2022 at 01:36, RandoEFC said:

Lampard's record is actually awful for a modern Everton manager. Made to look less awful because his predecessor had a similar record.

I wouldn't want us to sack him though for another loose cannon like Martinez or someone with no Premier League experience. I feel like you go with a Sean Dyche type where you know there's a glass ceiling to what you can achieve but at least you know more or less what you're getting. I'd trust Dyche to get 14th-16th with what we've got in the squad. It's not great though is it.

Bottom line is now though that Lampard's position has to be open to review. It's not good enough so far this season.

it's funny how we kind of won the lottery.  we were rumoured to be interested in Lampard and Slippy, Slippy got sacked, Frankie is close and Eddie has come out absolute champagne.  

[RandoEFC+]

How the fuck haven't they changed the manager yet? Gross, gross negligence.

[Stan]

How the hell did you get a draw against Man City in amongst that  

[Stan]

@RandoEFC - Sean Dyche not being considered to replace Lampard? Good/bad decision? I think he's someone that would immediately be able to at least shut up shop and stop you conceding. Has worked with Tarkowski and McNeil before too. 

[Lucas]

2 minutes ago, Stan said:

@RandoEFC - Sean Dyche not being considered to replace Lampard? Good/bad decision? I think he's someone that would immediately be able to at least shut up shop and stop you conceding. Has worked with Tarkowski and McNeil before too. 

As someone who has banged the Dyche to Everton drum repeatedly for a couple years now, Sean Dyche is the only viable option.

I think he'll finally get the gig. I can't see how they can avoid him. He is taylor-made.

[Stan]

11 minutes ago, Lucas said:

As someone who has banged the Dyche to Everton drum repeatedly for a couple years now, Sean Dyche is the only viable option.

I think he'll finally get the gig. I can't see how they can avoid him. He is taylor-made.

I'm happily take him now if it meant we would stop conceding 2+ per game. And also if it meant a relegation-rival didn't get him. 

[OrangeKhrush]

On 28/12/2022 at 19:49, MUFC said:

it's the typical institutional points, at the end of the day.  here is my concern with this whole gays aren't given opportunity rhetoric, the reality is that not many gay men are interested in playing, let alone getting to the highest professional level. 

 

 if Messi turned out to be gay would anyone really say bad things about him or be mean (real Madrid and French fans were mean to him and he is straight)?   the crutch in western civilization is this notion that being gay is a criteria, it's just that they are not good enough.  

the fact that not many gay players make it to the top levels is due to ability not discrimination.

this applies to seb Vetty who wants a token LGBTQ driver in F1, but there are none even doing lower levels.   how insulting is it to young drivers who actually dedicate to their craft when tokenism is weighted more than merit

[Lucas]

51 minutes ago, Stan said:

I'm happily take him now if it meant we would stop conceding 2+ per game. And also if it meant a relegation-rival didn't get him. 

There's been worse calls for sure.

I think Dyche will unite any team in disaray and bereft of confidence. He's one of the best man managers around and you don't hear a bad word said for his one to one management.

To say he can't play good Football as well is a bit of a myth because his Burnley team could play at times and looked decent doing so. With better technical players, I think he'd openly encourage that more once but obviously he would look to improve the basics first because of the situation he's inheriting.

For me, he's a solid candidate and too many people write him off all because he played to Burnley's strengths. I see him more for Everton than I do Leicester tbh however, if you got him, I think it would be a very sensible move.

[Stan]

58 minutes ago, OrangeKhrush said:

it's the typical institutional points, at the end of the day.  here is my concern with this whole gays aren't given opportunity rhetoric, the reality is that not many gay men are interested in playing, let alone getting to the highest professional level. 

 

 if Messi turned out to be gay would anyone really say bad things about him or be mean (real Madrid and French fans were mean to him and he is straight)?   the crutch in western civilization is this notion that being gay is a criteria, it's just that they are not good enough.  

the fact that not many gay players make it to the top levels is due to ability not discrimination.

this applies to seb Vetty who wants a token LGBTQ driver in F1, but there are none even doing lower levels.   how insulting is it to young drivers who actually dedicate to their craft when tokenism is weighted more than merit

And you know this, how? What studies have you done, or is it just a sweeping generalisation?

How do you know that 'the reality is not many gay men are interested in playing'? Based on what?

[RandoEFC+]

Dyche does seem an obvious choice but I did see a rumour from a source I consider reliable (can't remember which one) that he's not being considered.

It's really hard to see how any manager can come into this skip-fire and hope to succeed. Lampard obviously looks a pretty poor manager now with his combined record over the three spells he's had with different clubs, but the foundations and structure aren't there for any manager to realistically have a flyer with Everton. The next manager will be our 8th since Moshiri took over, not counting caretakers. How many times can it be the manager's fault? At best, the people picking the shite managers shouldn't be picking them anymore. More realistically, there's so much behind the scenes and running through the club that isn't set up for success that there's a limit to how much any new coach could achieve at the club, and it isn't a high ceiling.

I at least saw that Thelwell the DoF will be doing the shortlisting this time. He's probably shite because he was employed by Moshiri and this board, but at least he hasn't been associated with the last decade of failure and decline, so maybe he'll actually make a decent call. But if he does then Moshiri will probably override it and do something mental and stupid instead.

[LFCMike]

Dyche is a red isn't he?

[RandoEFC+]

Doucoure apparently not training with the first team following a dressing room bust-up. Presumably with Lampard? So it probably doesn't matter. Just another issue to throw on the pile. He's been absolute shite for about 18 months though. I won't lose any sleep about him not featuring in the first team as a result but he's sitting on a mad weekly wage while offering the club nothing like so many others. 

[RandoEFC+]

Danjuma deal is all signed at least. Not seen much of him but we're desperate for forward reinforcements.

Seems to be an issue with Gordon as well now. Being linked with Newcastle again and apparently "didn't want to travel" to the West Ham game (unconfirmed). But his attitude has been poor this season and his performances have stunk the place out. Gladly see the back of him. The problem is that he'll go somewhere else where the environment actually exists to enable players to succeed and he'll do well.

It's not a coincidence that so many promising young players have just stagnated at Everton and either stuck around and been a part of the decline or gone elsewhere and improved. Holgate, Godfrey, Davies, Gordon, Lookman, Kean. You can't develop players like this when you've had 7 managers in 9 years or whatever it is, without a consistent style of coaching and tactical approach between them.

[OrangeKhrush]

it has to be dyche