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Does Dyche Deserve A Bigger Move?

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What’d we think? My calculations were that he’s spent £130m the last 5 years, £90m less than Eddie Howe and their league positions are very similar...Dyches football maybe shit to watch but it’s efficient.

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Yeah, buy some 6’4” footballers, hoof it up and hope for the best. Who wouldn’t want him at their club xD

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There is a certain snobbery about him but I think he's fine where he is, and that's his remit.

Managing a football club is a bit like boxing with weights, there are totally different jobs. Dyche probably wouldn't work at a big club but is perfect for the role he now has. 

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15 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

Yeah, buy some 6’4” footballers, hoof it up and hope for the best. Who wouldn’t want him at their club xD

It’s hoofball yeah but Dyche comes across as more calculated than you’re giving him credit for

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2 minutes ago, Danny said:

It’s hoofball yeah but Dyche comes across as more calculated than you’re giving him credit for

Allardyce gets far more shit for the exact same football. Not exactly fair is it?

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Just now, DeadLinesman said:

Allardyce gets far more shit for the exact same football. Not exactly fair is it?

Allardyce has managed bigger clubs than Burnley in fairness. And we all know where his limit is. Dyche could still surprise with a bigger budget

Not saying I’d want to see him at my club mind 😂 Just think with the shit the likes of Newcastle, Everton and West Ham go through Dyche wouldn’t be that bad

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53 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

There is a certain snobbery about him but I think he's fine where he is, and that's his remit.

Managing a football club is a bit like boxing with weights, there are totally different jobs. Dyche probably wouldn't work at a big club but is perfect for the role he now has. 

Couldn't really put it better than this.

37 minutes ago, Danny said:

Allardyce has managed bigger clubs than Burnley in fairness. And we all know where his limit is. Dyche could still surprise with a bigger budget

Not saying I’d want to see him at my club mind 😂 Just think with the shit the likes of Newcastle, Everton and West Ham go through Dyche wouldn’t be that bad

Had this conversation a few times over the years. I can't speak for West Ham or Newcastle but from our point of view, we don't want a manager like Allardyce or Dyche who can guarantee you 7th every season. We had a decade of that under Moyes. I have no regrets about us plumping for Silva instead of keeping Allardyce for example because it may have gone tits up but at least going down that route gives you hope that something out of the ordinary might happen.

West Ham and Newcastle are probably slightly different because they have a greater risk of going down if they have a bad 2-3 months.

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36 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said:

Allardyce gets far more shit for the exact same football. Not exactly fair is it?

There were times of Allardyce's reign at Bolton where I actually felt Bolton played some nice stuff. He's got the reputation he had for a reason, but I don't think (with Bolton at least) that he was quite as one dimensional as Dyche at Burnley has been - @Pig on the Wing do you agree?

I can't imagine Jay-Jay Okocha playing at this Burnley (… you know, if he was around the same age as when he was at Bolton, not now that he's retired...) - so I think until he shows a bit more tactical flexibility... no he doesn't deserve a bigger move. He's proven he can set up a side to play some turgid shite that'll get the results to stay in the league - he's not shown he can really do more than that.

As a result, I think the biggest move for him that I think he'd deserve would really just be a sideways step move.

39 minutes ago, Danny said:

Just think with the shit the likes of Newcastle, Everton and West Ham go through Dyche wouldn’t be that bad

Everton have money and ambition, though. There's no evidence out there that Dyche could take Everton's money and match their ambition - also with Everton being a big club that's developed a small club mentality after decades of not being great, I think a manager like Ancelotti who was a world class central midfielder and has an incredible pedigree as a manager is a better fit for a big club wanting to be a big club again. Everton fans want/need a manager that can make them dream again, not just make them content that they'll remain in the league... or even that they'd be the "best of the rest."

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4 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Couldn't really put it better than this.

Had this conversation a few times over the years. I can't speak for West Ham or Newcastle but from our point of view, we don't want a manager like Allardyce or Dyche who can guarantee you 7th every season. We had a decade of that under Moyes. I have no regrets about us plumping for Silva instead of keeping Allardyce for example because it may have gone tits up but at least going down that route gives you hope that something out of the ordinary might happen.

West Ham and Newcastle are probably slightly different because they have a greater risk of going down if they have a bad 2-3 months.

Yeah considering the money you’re trying to spend I wouldn’t want Dyche personally, but with that said West Ham have money to spend and he’d probably be able to make them fairly competitive considering how shit they have been

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Just now, Dr. Gonzo said:

There were times of Allardyce's reign at Bolton where I actually felt Bolton played some nice stuff. He's got the reputation he had for a reason, but I don't think (with Bolton at least) that he was quite as one dimensional as Dyche at Burnley has been - @Pig on the Wing do you agree?

I can't imagine Jay-Jay Okocha playing at this Burnley (… you know, if he was around the same age as when he was at Bolton, not now that he's retired...) - so I think until he shows a bit more tactical flexibility... no he doesn't deserve a bigger move. He's proven he can set up a side to play some turgid shite that'll get the results to stay in the league - he's not shown he can really do more than that.

As a result, I think the biggest move for him that I think he'd deserve would really just be a sideways step move.

Everton have money and ambition, though. There's no evidence out there that Dyche could take Everton's money and match their ambition - also with Everton being a big club that's developed a small club mentality after decades of not being great, I think a manager like Ancelotti who was a world class central midfielder and has an incredible pedigree as a manager is a better fit for a big club wanting to be a big club again. Everton fans want/need a manager that can make them dream again, not just make them content that they'll remain in the league... or even that they'd be the "best of the rest."

Yeah Everton is a stretch, now they have Ancelotti anyway, but after Silva really hasn’t done more than Dyche 

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Just now, Danny said:

Yeah Everton is a stretch, now they have Ancelotti anyway, but after Silva really hasn’t done more than Dyche 

Tbh, I always thought Silva was a weird appointment & a lot of my Blueshite mates agreed with me at the time when he was appointed. Then they liked him a bit at the end of last season... then this season came around and they were all acting like they were clinically depressed and just 1 bad result away from suicide.

I think Ancelotti's a great appointment for them, tbh, even if his stock has fallen a bit after how his time in Germany ended and his last stint with Napoli. They're at a stage in a rebuild now where I think you can point fingers squarely at the players - not the manager - when shite goes poorly for Everton. That's especially true because Ancelotti joined midseason - he's not signed any players. Imo, you could see right away watching Everton under Ancelotti that he's a much better tactician than Silva ever was - in his first victory for them, he made changes to the Everton's shape (I think it was a 3-4-3, that'd be come a 3-4-1-2... although you can argue that's still just a 3-4-3). I actually think it was against Dyche's Burnley tbh...

So I guess to go full circle, I think that match is actually evidence that Dyche's a better tactician than he's largely given credit for because his sides serve up some shite that I think most people would find not great to watch.

Honestly, I think it's tough for him to get a move to a bigger club. For him to play more expansive football, I feel he'd need to be at a club with more resources than Burnley. But I also feel like he won't get a chance to show that while he's still with Burnley… which'll have clubs thinking he's just got his one way of playing.

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Big club fans always turn their noses up at pragmatic football. But when you can't spend your way out of a hole and the cost of a poor season is relegation there's not much I wouldn't do as an owner to keep my club afloat. Just ask stoke City fans. If they'd have kept Pulis they's probably still be in the league right now occupying the same niche as Burnley. 

That said I think he's at the right level. Keeping a team built to play his style up

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Moving clubs is overrated.

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Dyche has been at the club since 2012, and since then they've spent four years in the Premier League. That's pretty good and at this point in time you could say his ethos is an important part of the club's current identity. If we look into the next decade and Burnley are in the PL for all of that time, that is a huge success, and perhaps a statement that Burnley is now 'bigger' (whatever that means) than other clubs that have a habit of yo-yoing. If Newcastle, West Ham, or whomever bounce up and down between leagues are they really 'bigger' than a team that consistently stays in the top league?

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Yes, they are.

 

I don't think Dyche should get offered a position at a club with higher aspirations than Burnley unless they are looking for someone to just stave off relegation.

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I think Dyche would do well at a different club. He's probably hampered by what he wants to achieve because of the spending power of Burnley and the fact that he has a squad that works a particular way and replacing all the pieces of that squad creates so much dissonance that they wouldn't achieve the goal of staying in the Prem. All that said, who would take a risk on him? 

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So what can Dyche realistically do to prove he’s better than just staving off relegation? He’s kept Burnley up and had a top half finish/made a Europa League spot and he’s got one of the lowest wage bills and money spent in transfers. He’s clearly overachiever imo, if you look at West Ham and the money they’ve spent on players like Anderson and Haller do you not think he’d be able to eventually have them knocking around the Europa League spots consistently?

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12 hours ago, DeadLinesman said:

Allardyce gets far more shit for the exact same football. Not exactly fair is it?

You beat me to it, Dyche is a clone of Big Sam xD

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Allardyce's early days were very different to Burnley. They were more like Pulis' Stoke. By the end at Bolton with Anelka they played a bit better. 

Allardyce was also more about wheeling and dealing, agent bungs, cheap foreign players, big wages and massive squad size/turnover. 

 

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19 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

Allardyce's early days were very different to Burnley. They were more like Pulis' Stoke. By the end at Bolton with Anelka they played a bit better. 

Allardyce was also more about wheeling and dealing, agent bungs, cheap foreign players, big wages and massive squad size/turnover. 

 

So he was Harry Redknapp then :ph34r:

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Big Sam has certainly done the rounds, 65 years old, I wonder if he will manage again and who with this time? 

Teams managed
1991–1992 Limerick (player-manager)
1992 Preston North End (caretaker manager)
1994–1996 Blackpool
1997–1999 Notts County
1999–2007 Bolton Wanderers
2007–2008 Newcastle United
2008–2010 Blackburn Rovers
2011–2015 West Ham United
2015–2016 Sunderland
2016 England
2016–2017 Crystal Palace
2017–2018 Everton

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Not that it's a step up but from our perspective hes the logical long term replacement for Roy Hodgson given the type of style we implement. People call it defensive and boring, I call it sticking a middle finger up at the Xg enthusiasts. I could see Dyche to Palace happening if he was interested in moving back to London.

I'd trust him to replace our ageing squad with a core of British players that look like they all work on a building site.

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