Arsenal Discussion

[Panna King]

Arsenal were going downhill halfway through Arsene Wengers reign, when the players wanted to leave to win things.  That shows you that the players had lost faith in his ways, it just took a few more years before that feeling filtered down to the fans. Since that period the recruitment and the whole management of the club has been a disaster. 

[Panna King]

On 22/07/2020 at 13:28, LFCMadLad said:

I said it time and time again when Arsenal fans wanted Wenger gone... be careful what you wish for. 

Come on, Wenger is an old man he was going to go at some stage, Arsenal needed a fresh approach but even during Wengers time the recruitment was a disaster which has left Arsenal in a mess on the field and also financially now. It just makes me laugh when everyone used to say that Arsenal were the best run club  they made out they were following FFP but that was just an excuse to cover up the huge mistakes from Wenger and Gazidis. 

 

I am very worried for the future of Arsenal by the people they have in place for recruitment, Edu and Sanllehi could actually bankrupt the club by the deals they are putting together and they only received 48 million from player sales this season.  Already not even a year in place of their jobs, they have paid £75 million for Pepe, 16 Million loan fee for Ceballos with no option to buy, 8 Million for Luiz who only signed a year contract at the time, 5 million for Cedric who only signed a 6 month contract during that deal, 25 Million for Tierney who has been good of late but has been very injury prone, Mari 8 Million loan fee again unknown at this level as he has hardly featured due to injuries.  Saliba 27 Million is an unknown but a huge amount of money to pay for a club that need defenders but made a strange decision to send him back on loan and Martinelli for 8 Million looks the best business out of the lot but for some reason Arteta never starts him who is now out injured for the rest of the year.   

In the future buying players like Coutinho is not the answer and is only going to make Agents richer and not improve Arsenal at all. 

Edited July 26, 2020 by SirBalon 69

[LFCMadLad]

9 hours ago, SirBalon 69 said:

Come on, Wenger is an old man he was going to go at some stage, Arsenal needed a fresh approach but even during Wengers time the recruitment was a disaster which has left Arsenal in a mess on the field and also financially now. It just makes me laugh when everyone used to say that Arsenal were the best run club  they made out they were following FFP but that was just an excuse to cover up the huge mistakes from Wenger and Gazidis. 

 

I am very worried for the future of Arsenal by the people they have in place for recruitment, Edu and Sanllehi could actually bankrupt the club by the deals they are putting together and they only received 48 million from player sales this season.  Already not even a year in place of their jobs, they have paid £75 million for Pepe, 16 Million loan fee for Ceballos with no option to buy, 8 Million for Luiz who only signed a year contract at the time, 5 million for Cedric who only signed a 6 month contract during that deal, 25 Million for Tierney who has been good of late but has been very injury prone, Mari 8 Million loan fee again unknown at this level as he has hardly featured due to injuries.  Saliba 27 Million is an unknown but a huge amount of money to pay for a club that need defenders but made a strange decision to send him back on loan and Martinelli for 8 Million looks the best business out of the lot but for some reason Arteta never starts him who is now out injured for the rest of the year.   

In the future buying players like Coutinho is not the answer and is only going to make Agents richer and not improve Arsenal at all. 

Coutinho would improve Arsenal without any shadow of a doubt. 

[Panna King]

3 hours ago, LFCMadLad said:

Coutinho would improve Arsenal without any shadow of a doubt. 

It is not a player we need as it will go the same way with Ozil.

[Panna King]

On 25/07/2020 at 19:42, Dr. Gonzo said:

I doubt Wenger was happy about constantly coming 4th and then clubs moving passed him, I just don’t think he wanted to be seen as moaning about his bosses in the media and he didn’t think throwing players he signed under the bus was good management. You don’t get to be a successful top flight manager without being very competitive and normally very competitive people are hurt the most by their failures.

And while I think he was a legend, he left around the right time. Things under him had clearly rotted away and his methods weren’t successful. But I don’t think there was ever a solid plan for post-Arsene Arsenal.

And @shut up is right that Arsene had a more old-school hands on approach with bringing players in, negotiating with them over contracts, and doing stuff that nowadays we see more and more clubs delegate that power to a Director of Football and let the manager focus more on the results. I wonder how much of that power Wenger had as a manager was also available to Emery. Because I don’t think Emery is really suited to that sort of stuff.

It’s always a tough ask though, to fill the shoes of a legend. Even one who’s last years at the club he was a legend at didn’t go so great. But I do think the rebuild becomes a lot harder after a season where a club’s spent a lot and the squad looks even more unbalanced than it did the season prior.

Wenger was one of the few managers left in Europe that didnt have a director of football, he had a say in everything along with Ivan Gazidis.  

[Dr. Gonzo]

10 minutes ago, SirBalon 69 said:

It is not a player we need as it will go the same way with Ozil.

Ozil’s a spent force, Coutinho’s in his prime, does a lot more defensive work than Ozick, and it’s not that long ago he was one of the best players in the league. He’d walk into your midfield, easy.

Arsenal aren’t too big that they can’t build a side around Coutinho to improve where they are currently. Especially not in their current state. And the best you’ll see from him is when the side is built around him in attack.

[Chaaay AFC]

On 25/07/2020 at 19:42, Dr. Gonzo said:

I doubt Wenger was happy about constantly coming 4th and then clubs moving passed him, I just don’t think he wanted to be seen as moaning about his bosses in the media and he didn’t think throwing players he signed under the bus was good management. You don’t get to be a successful top flight manager without being very competitive and normally very competitive people are hurt the most by their failures.

And while I think he was a legend, he left around the right time. Things under him had clearly rotted away and his methods weren’t successful. But I don’t think there was ever a solid plan for post-Arsene Arsenal.

And @shut up is right that Arsene had a more old-school hands on approach with bringing players in, negotiating with them over contracts, and doing stuff that nowadays we see more and more clubs delegate that power to a Director of Football and let the manager focus more on the results. I wonder how much of that power Wenger had as a manager was also available to Emery. Because I don’t think Emery is really suited to that sort of stuff.

It’s always a tough ask though, to fill the shoes of a legend. Even one who’s last years at the club he was a legend at didn’t go so great. But I do think the rebuild becomes a lot harder after a season where a club’s spent a lot and the squad looks even more unbalanced than it did the season prior.

Emery had no say on transfers that's how the club operates now. He pretty much come out and said all of the players he wanted last summer he didn't get. For one he wanted Zaha over Pepe and I believe Thomas Partey. He was also keen on keeping Ramsey which the club went against. 

[Panna King]

25 minutes ago, Chaaay AFC said:

Emery had no say on transfers that's how the club operates now. He pretty much come out and said all of the players he wanted last summer he didn't get. For one he wanted Zaha over Pepe and I believe Thomas Partey. He was also keen on keeping Ramsey which the club went against. 

Ramsey wanted a lot of money and they pulled the plug on his contract  but he would've been worth keeping as he was a goal scoring midfielder,  we have no one now from midfield who scores.  Pepe is not rated at all, Emery didn't rate him and you can also see Arteta doesn't trust him.

[Panna King]

20 hours ago, LFCMadLad said:

Coutinho would improve Arsenal without any shadow of a doubt. 

Well Coutinho is kind of turning into James Rodriquez, its going to be an expensive risk to sign him or a costly loan fee for him.  If it doesnt work out we will find it hard selling him as Barcelona are finding out after only signing him a few years ago. 

Edited July 27, 2020 by SirBalon 69

[Cicero]

Arsenal are trying to cut the wage bill, not inflate it even more. Which is what both Coutinho and Willian will 100% do. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

2 hours ago, Cicero said:

Arsenal are trying to cut the wage bill, not inflate it even more. Which is what both Coutinho and Willian will 100% do. 

Any signings they make, unless they clear the deadwood (which may be harder than it sounds), will inflate their wage bill. If they want to cut the wage bill, there's a big chunk just going to one man that's not made any real meaningful contribution to the club in years. But they're never going to shift off Ozil without subsidising some of his wages, so they're a bit fucked in that regard.

[Spike]

21 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Ozil’s a spent force, Coutinho’s in his prime, does a lot more defensive work than Ozick, and it’s not that long ago he was one of the best players in the league. He’d walk into your midfield, easy.

Arsenal aren’t too big that they can’t build a side around Coutinho to improve where they are currently. Especially not in their current state. And the best you’ll see from him is when the side is built around him in attack.

Coutinho is past his prime

[Dr. Gonzo]

Just now, Spike said:

Coutinho is past his prime

I mean, depends how you look at it. He's not done well since leaving us, and maybe he never will reach those heights again because he'll never be on a team that good again that's built around him. But maybe he will. But in terms of a players "physical prime/peak". He's 28, most people's physical prime is 28-29 (granted, not true for everyone). But chances he's a completely spent force, when he's not a player that really relied on pace or physicality primarily... and hasn't had injuries to affect those parts of his game, I think are unlikely.

He's failed at Barca and Bayern because he does best when a side's attack runs through him, whereas at Barca and Bayern they've got better players than him and they're not going to change what's worked for them to build a side around him. Tbh, I don't even know why Barca signed him as they didn't want to use him where he proved effective for us. I think Bayern fans have said he's done alright, but not as good as a player that's on the kind of wages and would cost the amount he costs should do.

I think he needs to do what he did when he left Inter, or similar to what Riquelme did in leaving Barca - go to a club that'll make him a centrepiece of how they create and attack, and you'll get the best from Coutinho. You can argue this makes him a bit of a "luxury player" because when there's a solid team unit... you might argue he doesn't quite fit in and maybe the side is better without him. 

I think if Arsenal signed him and built their midfield and attack around him feeding Aubamayang, they'd end up looking a lot fucking better going forward than they do currently. 

Although, should he be a priority for them? Probably not... but I don't know. There's so much about Arsenal - I think Arsenal need big changes in defense and midfield and I'm glad I'm not anywhere near involved in figuring out how they start going about being less mediocre.

[LFCMadLad]

Aubameyang : "I don't usually talk on behalf of anyone, but I see a need to stand for Sadio Mane who deserves at least a reward for his great season. I must say it is very disappointing to witness him walking away empty handed. I don't know what criteria they use to award the Awards, but I believe am not the only one who feels Mane should have won an individual Award in Premier league this season. When you look at Liverpool victories, Mane was a driving force behind that. Am not bias or something, but it is the facts.”

[Spike]

Just now, LFCMadLad said:

Aubameyang : "I don't usually talk on behalf of anyone, but I see a need to stand for Sadio Mane who deserves at least a reward for his great season. I must say it is very disappointing to witness him walking away empty handed. I don't know what criteria they use to award the Awards, but I believe am not the only one who feels Mane should have won an individual Award in Premier league this season. When you look at Liverpool victories, Mane was a driving force behind that. Am not bias or something, but it is the facts.”

He got a bloody reward, it's called the Premier League Trophy

[Stan]

21 minutes ago, LFCMadLad said:

Aubameyang : "I don't usually talk on behalf of anyone, but I see a need to stand for Sadio Mane who deserves at least a reward for his great season. I must say it is very disappointing to witness him walking away empty handed. I don't know what criteria they use to award the Awards, but I believe am not the only one who feels Mane should have won an individual Award in Premier league this season. When you look at Liverpool victories, Mane was a diving force behind that. Am not bias or something, but it is the facts.”

Agreed. 

[The Artful Dodger]

People put too much stock in these individual awards, as Spike says, I think the league title is reward enough. It's funny how wound up Manchester City get about it though.

Edited July 30, 2020 by The Artful Dodger

[Dr. Gonzo]

These top level athletes are hyper competitive. These individual awards are things they can point to that set them apart from their colleagues at the end of the day. And when your colleagues are some of the best footballers in the world, that’s got to feel great to people who are hardwired to be constantly competing.

The other day Vardy was talking about the golden boot like it was just as good as winning the league, so it’s pretty clear to the players personally... these individual honours are very very important.

I’m sure most of us would agree... Mane was rewarded for his excellent season with a league winners medal. He’s also clearly one of the most admired players in the league for what he’s done this season. He’s got fans, pundits, players all singing his praises. He’ll be remembered for his efforts this season.

But I don’t think it’s surprising elite level athletes competing at the best care a lot about the recognition in their fields.

[Chaaay AFC]

16 hours ago, shut up said:

Hope we win the europa league next season. our record in Europe has been average all things considered

 

 

 

Yeah hopefully we go for it again, I do think a season out of Europe could've been beneficial and would've allowed us to trim out some more of the squad. Knowing the players we have they will all still be here next season so they can at least provide some rotation in the group stages. 

[Stan]

55 staff to be made redundant but about to offer a player a few million over a few years, not to mention the other wages at the club... 

https://www.arsenal.com/news/club-update-2020

 

[Spike]

7 minutes ago, Stan said:

55 staff to be made redundant but about to offer a player a few million over a few years, not to mention the other wages at the club... 

https://www.arsenal.com/news/club-update-2020

 

Hope they find wok

[Danny]

 

[...Dan]

What the fuck?

[Storts]

Scum club, no surprise. 

[LFCMadLad]

Thats fucking shocking. Arteta must wonder what the fuck he's joined.