American Politics Discussion

[OrangeKhrush]

10 hours ago, Waylander said:

Political fights brweing in the US over continued illegal immigration.

Abbott of Texas and De Santis of Florida following Presidential orders they cannot stop illegal border crossings have started moving illegals to Northern States.

50 were flown to Marthas Vine Yard, who said they could not cope and someon piped up the Obamas have a ten bedroom mansion...........

http://www.yourdestinationnow.com/2022/09/marthas-vineyard-shelter-coordinators.html

of course the the people there don't want them.   the only reason they want mass illegal immigration is to try convert border states blue by thinking they can convince them to vote for their pretentious virtue signaling.

 

whoopsie Goldberg and the harlots on the view think that sending people to Martha's vineyard is cruel and inhumane,  sure sending people to a tourist paradise is inhumane.

[Honey Honey]

Illegal immigrants can't vote. Even legal immigrants can't vote.

[Waylander]

Yet the voting rights can be changed though would require legislation.

[Dr. Gonzo]

On 16/09/2022 at 23:07, OrangeKhrush said:

of course the the people there don't want them.   the only reason they want mass illegal immigration is to try convert border states blue by thinking they can convince them to vote for their pretentious virtue signaling.

 

whoopsie Goldberg and the harlots on the view think that sending people to Martha's vineyard is cruel and inhumane,  sure sending people to a tourist paradise is inhumane.

Perhaps DeSantis has that idea because Cubans can come to the US in what would otherwise be illegal immigration, but because of the Cold War, undocumented immigrants from Cuba get a pathway to citizenship in the US. And they are a reliably conservative voter block in Florida.

In the rest of the country though, even legal immigrants don't have voting rights. You've got to become a naturalised citizen to be able to vote as an immigrant.

I think it's more considered inhumane because taking people from one place without telling them where they're going is... kidnapping and human trafficking... Not so much the destination they've been sent to. And I think most normal people would find kidnapping and human trafficking to be morally wrong.

I think it backfired though as the plan was to piss off a wealthy "left wing" (although I think Martha's Vineyard is more classically liberal and not really left-wing at all) neighborhood and instead that community rallied around these migrants who were trafficked from Florida to Martha's Vineyard to provide them support. It's managed to piss off even conservative Hispanic groups too.

And it's just another example of a culture war being fought by America's political "leaders" rather than doing anything to address the issues. No surprise DeSantis is waging yet another culture war though.

[OrangeKhrush]

9 hours ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

Perhaps DeSantis has that idea because Cubans can come to the US in what would otherwise be illegal immigration, but because of the Cold War, undocumented immigrants from Cuba get a pathway to citizenship in the US. And they are a reliably conservative voter block in Florida.

In the rest of the country though, even legal immigrants don't have voting rights. You've got to become a naturalised citizen to be able to vote as an immigrant.

I think it's more considered inhumane because taking people from one place without telling them where they're going is... kidnapping and human trafficking... Not so much the destination they've been sent to. And I think most normal people would find kidnapping and human trafficking to be morally wrong.

I think it backfired though as the plan was to piss off a wealthy "left wing" (although I think Martha's Vineyard is more classically liberal and not really left-wing at all) neighborhood and instead that community rallied around these migrants who were trafficked from Florida to Martha's Vineyard to provide them support. It's managed to piss off even conservative Hispanic groups too.

And it's just another example of a culture war being fought by America's political "leaders" rather than doing anything to address the issues. No surprise DeSantis is waging yet another culture war though.

the solution is to take strict action on illegals and focus on securing the border.   the problems that come from illegals far outweighs any humanitarian argument and that is coming to the UK now where virtue calling is for votes but fails to address the real issues.

Abbott and DeSantis sent a total of 100 illegals who consented to movement to "sanctuary states".   which Virginia and Massachusetts are.   

[Waylander]

We saw Sweden swing towards the poltical Right recently.

Part of this swing was seen as a policeman blew the lid on a breakdown of violent crime over a weekend and then read the countries where the offenders came from.

There was the possibility of legal action as he spoke out of turn although due to public support no legal action was taken.

 

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

Abbott and DeSantis sent a total of 100 illegals who consented to movement to "sanctuary states".   which Virginia and Massachusetts are.   

Yeah, you should actually look into the details they weren’t even told where they were going and had to fill out false DHS forms. Everyone involved should be investigated

[Viva la FCB+]

Watch the first 3 mins - those are the facts as the Sheriff knows. 

 

[OrangeKhrush]

Martha's vineyard is paradise, the could have been given work and shelter in a lucrative holiday location.   they ended up getting deported by national guard and dumped in New York whose governed has said they receive thousands of illegals daily from California, Chicago, Pennsylvania.

the solution was to close borders but they haven't done didly squat because illegal influx together with no I'D no problem voting legislation is purely done to dilute the voter base.  

Sweden tried being a sanctuary and what followed was a sociopolitical crisis where Swedes are becoming minority in there own country in specific towns

illegal immigration is bad and should be a matter of urgency but they don't care.

[Dr. Gonzo]

23 hours ago, OrangeKhrush said:

Martha's vineyard is paradise, the could have been given work and shelter in a lucrative holiday location.   they ended up getting deported by national guard and dumped in New York whose governed has said they receive thousands of illegals daily from California, Chicago, Pennsylvania.

the solution was to close borders but they haven't done didly squat because illegal influx together with no I'D no problem voting legislation is purely done to dilute the voter base.  

Sweden tried being a sanctuary and what followed was a sociopolitical crisis where Swedes are becoming minority in there own country in specific towns

illegal immigration is bad and should be a matter of urgency but they don't care.

They were promised jobs in Massachusets by Florida, who had no authority to promise those jobs to people. They purposefully didn't notify anyone at DHS in Marthas Vineyard that they were sending migrants there. They were also told they were being flown to Boston and that's where they'd get work. They were instead sent to Martha's Vineyard to embarrass Kamala Harris while she's there. It was all a political stunt.

They're also being housed in Massachusetts (the state Martha's Vineyard is in, btw) not New York. Begs the question where you're getting your news from tbh. California, Illinois and Pennsylvania are all "sanctuary states" as well - so doesn't really make sense why another sanctuary state would be taking in so many migrants seeking sanctuary.

They were also told to change their addresses with USCIS - which isn't the appropriate agency they'd be reporting address changes to. That was a deliberate attempt to get them flagged and fast tracked for deportation after they'd been used as pawns in a political stunt. DeSantis and relevant Florida agencies are now being sued, Texas is being investigated for it's own similar stunt, and the DOJ is investigating both states for being involved in kidnapping and human trafficking.

This isn't even properly about illegal immigration - the Biden administration has stopped more illegal immigrants at US borders than any other president's administration in US history in 2 years. People who live in cities and towns on the US-Mexico border aren't too concerned about illegal immigration either (source: I live in a city by the US-Mexico border) - there's a reason for that too, 1.) legal migration of Mexicans to the US, and vice versa, is easy as fuck - it's mostly the drug war that leads people to dig tunnels and use submarines; 2.) most illegal immigrants to the US enter via airports legally - and stay once their visas have expired.

This was just an attempt to bring immigration to the public eye again before the midterm elections (like that MiGrAnT cArAvAn that suddenly stopped being an issue for right wing media as soon as the last midterm elections were over) and bring a new front to DeSantis's culture war (because his "war on Disney" stopped being popular with his voters once people in Florida, especially Orlando, found their local and state taxes going up as a result... in the middle of the cost of living skyrocketing).

One thing I question: is why the fuck did it cost $500k to hire a jet to fly these people? A quick check indicates a private jet holding 40-50 people is significantly cheaper to hire for one flight that length. So is there some crony capitalism in the midst of this human trafficking scandal? My guess is: yeah, absolutely.

In any case, if the US wants more safety at the border with Mexico - they should be addressing their drug policy and doing what they can to stop their nation's drug problem from making Mexico a cartel ruled wild-west. And if the US wants more protection against illegal immigrants, it's got to be better about enforcement of expired visas.

Trafficking people to states that republicans don't like very much doesn't really solve the issue. Or any issue. It just furthers a culture war that doesn't serve to do anything other than further divide the country. And that's probably being done because otherwise people will pay attention and see that the rampant corporate corruption of America is probably the greatest issue it faces.

[Dr. Gonzo]

Also asylum seekers aren’t illegal immigrants.

[Viva la FCB+]

It gets better theres now a class action lawsuit against De Santis by the migrants god he deserves this blowback.

[Azeem]

According number of ex Guantanamo Bay detainees De Santis was the most notorious prison guard/interrogator. 

[Spike]

I was an illegal immigrant.

[Cicero]

10 hours ago, Beelzebub said:

According number of ex Guantanamo Bay detainees De Santis was the most notorious prison guard/interrogator. 

So De Santis dished out the cock meat sandwiches?

[nudge+]

21 minutes ago, Spike said:

I was an illegal immigrant.

How? Got in and didn't leave after the visa expired?

[nudge+]

21 minutes ago, Spike said:

I was an illegal immigrant.

How? Got in and didn't leave after the visa expired?

[Spike]

20 minutes ago, nudge said:

How? Got in and didn't leave after the visa expired?

Something of the sort.

[OrangeKhrush]

she was broken in the end, when you cannot admit what you are to peddle a de facto narrative.

this stems from Biden's catastrophic speech a few weeks back.  this woman should be nowhere near political influence but Joe is at it trying to tear america apart and start nuclear war with a nuclear power.

 

[Gunnersaurus]

You know when someone says people are becoming a minority in their own country most things they say can be ignored. Hardly anyone is completely indigenous to their country if you go back far enough and we dont know the ones that are because it goes back so far. The original Germanics for example come from Scandinavia. This indigenous bollocks that right wingers try to promote is noncence. It's even less likely in mainland Europe because it is all land that could be be walked over. Britian is an island and even we hardly have anyone who is completely indigenous. You never become a minority in your own country unless you want to use the definition of minority as people who family line is completely from the same country which is highly unlikely. This is all about people who look different. Its just a way of disguising racism. There is loads of information that can show you how the boundaries have changed and the history of invasions and conquests. Most british people are a mix of french, German,Italian Scandinavian and British.  Even the English language is a germanic language. If you are seriously worried that the culture will be different in 200 years or so then you need to reevaluate your life. Most countries have a mix of different cultural influences. Most things British for example aren't originally british including fish and chips 

Edited September 23, 2022 by Gunnersaurus

[Gunnersaurus]

On 22/09/2022 at 01:16, Dr. Gonzo said:

Also asylum seekers aren’t illegal immigrants.

Mate you're dealing with an absolute clown who will probably get banned at some point. Might well be banned member unique 

[Waylander]

3 hours ago, Gunnersaurus said:

You know when someone says people are becoming a minority in their own country most things they say can be ignored. Hardly anyone is completely indigenous to their country if you go back far enough and we dont know the ones that are because it goes back so far. The original Germanics for example come from Scandinavia. This indigenous bollocks that right wingers try to promote is noncence. It's even less likely in mainland Europe because it is all land that could be be walked over. Britian is an island and even we hardly have anyone who is completely indigenous. You never become a minority in your own country unless you want to use the definition of minority as people who family line is completely from the same country which is highly unlikely. This is all about people who look different. Its just a way of disguising racism. There is loads of information that can show you how the boundaries have changed and the history of invasions and conquests. Most british people are a mix of french, German,Italian Scandinavian and British.  Even the English language is a germanic language. If you are seriously worried that the culture will be different in 200 years or so then you need to reevaluate your life. Most countries have a mix of different cultural influences. Most things British for example aren't originally british including fish and chips 

I think you need to consider that between 12th Century England and the 19th Century England very little immigration and fairly homogenous culture.

Sure a lot of English has Germanic roots yet also has French in it too.

The closest linguistically today is Frisian spoken in small parts of the Netherlands.

 

 

[Gunnersaurus]

1 hour ago, Waylander said:

I think you need to consider that between 12th Century England and the 19th Century England very little immigration and fairly homogenous culture.

Sure a lot of English has Germanic roots yet also has French in it too.

The closest linguistically today is Frisian spoken in small parts of the Netherlands.

 

 

There is still not many indigenous brits if any. Very few peoples blood would go directly back to the original british settlers and have no foreign blood in it. The fact is that all countries have cultural influence from around the world. When immigration happens most of the time immigrants keep parts of their culture and over the generations they become more like the countries culture they are in. Countries then take parts of that culture that they like. This nonsense about loosing our culture is just that nonsense. Sure out culture will be different in 100 or so but it wont be forced.

[Azeem]

On 22/09/2022 at 21:38, Cicero said:

So De Santis dished out the cock meat sandwiches?

What? Details...

[Waylander]

18 hours ago, Gunnersaurus said:

There is still not many indigenous brits if any. Very few peoples blood would go directly back to the original british settlers and have no foreign blood in it. The fact is that all countries have cultural influence from around the world. When immigration happens most of the time immigrants keep parts of their culture and over the generations they become more like the countries culture they are in. Countries then take parts of that culture that they like. This nonsense about loosing our culture is just that nonsense. Sure out culture will be different in 100 or so but it wont be forced.

There was a study done and revealed a few years back that shocked the BBC, it was found that those with higher French / Norman ancestry were more likely to be successful in society after almost a millenium.

 Within Britain and Ireland there has been a lot of movement of peoples and an early influx from France.

Yet outside of this apart form the 20th Centruy we were fairly isolated.