FINAL - Spain 2-1 England - Sunday 14th July, 2024

[RandoEFC+]

Watched it out so don't know what the prevailing narratives and opinions are but my take on the game is as follows.

Both teams and the game started off pretty well but then fizzled out into a bit of a non-event of a first half. Spain looked more like they had a clue what they were doing when they carried the ball into the attacking third but didn't really create anything.

Second half, Spain were pretty much in control for most of it, didn't sit on their lead and could easily have killed it off with a second. Instead another moment of quality from England draws it level. Again I was left thinking how lucky this manager is. Based on the moments England players have produced to keep them in the tournament, they probably could have got this far with Rishi Sunak managing them. Spain obviously reestablished themselves after England equalised and went on to take a deserved win.

Spain were the best team in the opening set of fixtures and remained so throughout. Germany were the only ones who got close and really that quarter final between them should have been the final. I don't think I've ever seen so many "big" countries perform so poorly at a major tournament. England, France, Italy, Portugal and Belgium were all pretty shite. Netherlands had their moments but were disappointing overall too. Spain thoroughly deserve the trophy as the only team who looked like they were really used to playing as a cohesive unit and not just "keeping it tight" and hoping their star players produce a moment to decide the game.

That takes me on to England. The performance against the Netherlands was the only one that probably met expectations overall. The rest was pretty much crap performances bailed out by an individual moment of quality. That's usually enough to get you to a quarter final or a semi final before you get found out. On this occasion, thanks to a combination of how the draw panned out and a lack of actually good teams to get drawn against, it got England to the final before their luck ran out. You won't see another final with the performance England served up in the tournament overall. I think this might be the worst possible outcome for the team to be honest because it leaves them without a trophy again, but it's enough to see Southgate get given World Cup 2026 as well and he's just a bad manager.

Why is he a bad manager? We've just spent the entire tournament watching Kane, Foden and Bellingham look painfully ineffective compared to what we all know they're capable of. He changed the entire approach mid-tournament. I don't think any England player can come out of that tournament rated higher than a 7/10 and I don't think you could even go that high with any of the attacking players. You can't be given that much talent and not find a way of playing that gets near the best out of at least a couple of them.

Overall, I'm actually glad that tournament is over now. Group stages were class. The knockouts went on too long and the majority of those games were pretty turgid. Made me look forward to having the domestic season back at least.

[OrangeKhrush]

This will go down as england squandering glory, worse now as Rice, Bellingham, Saka, Foden, Palmer are better than the team 4 years ago.

Surely southgate has to be replaced

[Dan+]

The truth is always revealed in the end. The truth is England weren't even close to the second best team in this tournament - let alone the first.

A tournament from our perspective that will be remembered for individual moments of magic. Individual quality and one of the kindest imaginable runs to a final have pushed an illusion that this was a good tournament from England. It wasn't. In terms of the actual level I would argue it was Southgate's worst yet.

Well done to Spain - truly worthy winners from day one to the end.

[MUFC]

Took him 88 minutes to realise that the saviour Foden was doing fuck all.

[Tommy]

[Dan+]

16 minutes ago, OrangeKhrush said:

This will go down as england squandering glory, worse now as Rice, Bellingham, Saka, Foden, Palmer are better than the team 4 years ago.

Surely southgate has to be replaced

2021 worse for me, on home soil and against an Italy side who aged terribly. Make no mistake though I only feel like this because we performed below the sum of our parts all tournament anyway.

Once again, the first serious opposition for England and it's curtains.

[MUFC]

Another thing, Bellingham is one diving cunt.

 

[MUFC]

The whole competition, Kane and Foden were holding England back.

[MUFC]

Gary Neville dick sucking Kane prior to the game like his life depended on it.

[Smiley Culture]

I don’t watch a lot of football on the tele but from what I’ve seen, the best team overall won and certainly the best team on the night, won. England had their moments and tried to counter and for a short while, they looked as though they might take them to extra time, but ultimately England’s “moments” were not that long and you always felt like Spain could go up a gear. 
 

Jordan Pickford and Marc Guehi probably kept the scoreline respectable, at times and allowed England to stay in the game and I do feel a bit for Guehi getting caught the wrong side of Oyazarbal. As for Pickford, I’ll get tonnes of abuse from Evertonians on here I suspect but, he should be playing for a bigger club than Everton. He should be playing for a side in the Champions League. He’s criminally underrated and still gets a load of stick from people but his shot stopping is excellent and his destruction is usually very good. 

Harry Kane and Jude Bellingham are spent. They were three games ago but carrying an injury and playing nearly 70 games a piece in under twelve months is going to do that to you, I suppose. 

As for England, they’re in a good place. As much as they’ve not been aesthetically pleasing, many England sides over the years go out to Slovakia, they don’t equalise in the dying embers, they probably don’t beat Switzerland and they don’t come from behind against Netherlands either. They probably also lose that game tonight by three or four. There’s a change in mentality and application at International level, overseen by Southgate and he doesn’t get the credit he deserves. The problem with England is a warped expectation of them that they need to win a trophy. It’s not club football, lads. Trophies are hard to come by because they’re not a never ending cycle of trophies week after week for year after year, international tournaments are every two years and as such, they’re incredibly hard to win. I think people also demand to be entertained with England, too. Maybe because they care less than their club or they’re just out in a pub/overcharged in a bar/whatever but winning isn’t enough, they must be entertained in doing so and England need to be a reincarnation of Barcelona circa 2010. Sacking Southgate would be a ludicrous move. 

[Rick]

“Gareth Southgate is a genius” actually came out of that pillock Lee Dixon’s mouth during the commentary. 

[6666]

29 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

I don't think any England player can come out of that tournament rated higher than a 7/10.

Guehi should probably be in the team of the tournament to be fair, 8/10. Pickford too at GK, 7.5/10. Attacking wise, Saka has been decent out of an underwhelming bunch but probably no more than a 7/10. I'd say Stones was 7/10 as well. The subs did as much as you could expect and more but it's hard to rate subs.

A good defence with an average attack that relied on special moments.

[Devil-Dick Willie]

1 hour ago, Rick said:

Can we get a petition together for Spike and Devil knob to be co managers for the World Cup please. 

I promise with all my heart, I would not play a right back in midfield. I would not play a right back at left back, I would not pick 'all the best players on fifia' in my front 4 to trip over each other and get in each others way. 

The players would fucking hate me though hahahaha.

[Reluctant Striker]

It is time for Southgate to move on. It has been extraordinary how he has returned us back to the business end of tournaments. And not every 6 or 8 years or whatever. 2 finals, 1 semi & 1 quarter. In 4 consecutive tournaments. Anyone who doesn't see the improvement & recognise his achievements has not left school yet.

Spain were the best of an average bunch, compared to national teams I feel I've seen in the past. But England had a squad packed with serious potential. For the whole tournament had very little cohesion & style of play. Foden got used where he wanted to be used. And he only threatened to deliver. Bellingham had his overhead moment & took a superstar penalty. But was largely ineffectual. Kane looked like someone who had gone 1 tournament too far, at least as a starter. 

I think I have resigned myself to the fact England will never win a tournament in my lifetime. And I think I am at peace with that. But at the same time, it does feel worth the English FA actively seeking the best tactically shrewd manager available. Because Bellingham, Saka, Foden, Palmer, etc.

[Devil-Dick Willie]

Roberto Martinez. Took Belgium to 3rd, did okay with a shite Portugal team, speaks the kings English, knows the prem and English media.

[Dan+]

There is a case that England had the worst tournament we could've possibly had. We've fluked it far enough to breed the illusion that it was a good tournament performance, meaning that there won't be any proper reflection or anywhere near the criticism that there should be, but not enough luck for us to actually break our duck and get a trophy secured.

We've had our numbers come up on the lottery and not bought a ticket.

I've no doubt Southgate gets 2026. I've no doubt it goes similarly.

We would've been better in the long run to just lose to Slovakia. Force action. Embarrass us into striving for better.

As it is now we can just trot out the same stuff we hear all the time after a tournament failure. Ignore all objective criticism because we threw four sixes in a row with the draw.

I've not forgotten the gobbing off after the Slovakia win. You don't get to do that without the trophy. Where is it?

[Stan]

52 minutes ago, Dan said:

There is a case that England had the worst tournament we could've possibly had

Agree with all of your post apart from this bit. Surely the worst case would be going out at the group stage, not getting to the final and losing? 

Agree of course majority of the performances were poor. 

I don't think Southgate stays. 

[Dan+]

7 minutes ago, Stan said:

Agree with all of your post apart from this bit. Surely the worst case would be going out at the group stage, not getting to the final and losing? 

Agree of course majority of the performances were poor. 

I don't think Southgate stays. 

I get your point, but I think if this had happened, or had we lost to Slovakia, we'd have been forced to make some tough decisions. I don't think this outcome forces that. So it's better in the short-term to make a final rather than go out in the groups, but I think it removes a bit of that drive to improve.

I could be wrong but I've seen this before with England, we'll convince ourselves it was a good showing and we'll plod on.

I actually think Southgate himself while clearly limited (almost surely beyond any debate at this point) is going to take a lot of criticism away from players who didn't turn up either. Some rotten individual showings. Guehi, Palmer, Watkins and arguably Mainoo are probably the only ones who come out of this higher than they went in.

[Mel81x+]

Watkins should have started the second half imo and not come on as a sub. He was forcing their defense to stay back vs occupy midfield spaces that were just squandered. In any event, congrats to Spain. They were the best team of the tournament and didn't let up till the very end. Deserved winners.

[Dr. Gonzo]

[Mel81x+]

2 minutes ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

You'd never know there was a world class crosser of the ball on that bench with the way the manager set them up. 

[Devil-Dick Willie]

3 hours ago, Stan said:

Agree with all of your post apart from this bit. Surely the worst case would be going out at the group stage, not getting to the final and losing? 

Agree of course majority of the performances were poor. 

I don't think Southgate stays. 

I think the idea there is you went through each indvidiual game playing as shit as possible and now with no trophy again to show for it the FA will probably offer Southgate another contract based on the outcome, rather than the performance. 

Ask Klopp if he wants the team for the world cup cycle. If no, go Roberto surely. It would be so England to extend Southgate or offer it to Moyes or someone 

[Devil-Dick Willie]

1 hour ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

To be fair Kyle Walker has been either decent or a stand out in the past, and plays with Stones weekly, which is HUGE in international football IMO. I'd be grilling him (and Stones actually) for their performance this final, but Walker had an up and down tournament, and Southgate is never playing TAA in a million years if his plan is to win games 1-0.

[RandoEFC+]

No point playing Alexander-Arnold in this England team. You can be the best crosser in the world but it's useless putting a good ball into the box because Kane will be halfway between the centre circle and the edge of the box jogging vacantly forward rather than getting on the end of anything.

[Devil-Dick Willie]

3 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

No point playing Alexander-Arnold in this England team. You can be the best crosser in the world but it's useless putting a good ball into the box because Kane will be halfway between the centre circle and the edge of the box jogging vacantly forward rather than getting on the end of anything.

The best comment I saw on youtube in reply to Kanes interview after the game

"Harry Kane is so brilliant and elusive with his movement, you cross it into the box, but he's not there, he's off having a conversation with Pickford" 

It's funny as well because Rooney was often the same. A 'hard worker' at the cost of making tackles on the halfway line that left England without a focal point on the resulting attack, or inexplicably bombing down the wing with someone instead of running to the penalty spot.