Philippe Coutinho

[SirBalon]

Official:

 

[Honey Honey]

Prices in general are just a human guess, but it is all over the place these days. 

[Inverted]

Considering he's a couple years younger it's possible that Lemar could match Draxler's level down the line (even Draxler had a kind of disappointing season with Wolfsburg) but Draxler is probably the best immediate option, if available. 

He's imo even better than Coutinho when he's in form, though he's been without constant games this season. 

I definitely think it would be smart to sound out a few options to try and make sure that no single club feels their player is an indispensable target for Liverpool.

Fees are insane and no longer tied to any predictable standard, but if a club feels that a buyer can realistically say "nah too much, we'll go somewhere else", that takes at least some leverage away. 

Only approaching Monaco (who have already said they're reluctant to sell) and starting another Van Dijk saga would be insane.

[Bluewolf]

1 hour ago, SirBalon said:

As far as I’m concerned (I know it’s illegal and against freedom of movement and employment), but a player should be forced to respect his contract and that ONLY the club can decide the options put before them if another club comes in. When that occurs and they’re seriously thinking about moving a player on for whatever reason be it he doesn’t fit in or the offer is too good to refuse, only then should they put it before the player as an option.  Contracts in football should be respected but these days they mean very little.  Look at Neymar... He was happy enough to sign a new super improved contract four months before he then moved to PSG.  

In some respects I agree with this, It would put an end to all the transfer nonsense when a player is already under contract... I do think however that if it was the rule that contracts would be a lot shorter, Players would be unwilling to sign 4 or 5 year contracts tying them down to one club. Maybe 1 or 2 year contracts would be the norm instead.. 

[SirBalon]

2 minutes ago, Bluewolf said:

In some respects I agree with this, It would put an end to all the transfer nonsense when a player is already under contract... I do think however that if it was the rule that contracts would be a lot shorter, Players would be unwilling to sign 4 or 5 year contracts tying them down to one club. Maybe 1 or 2 year contracts would be the norm instead.. 

The problem for the players where reducing a possible maximum length of time a contract could be made for is that they’d (the players and their respective agents) would have less leverage to negotiate massive signing fees and salaries.  As things stand, clubs want to put the maximum timespan permitted because even though they understand that this means very little of the player suddenly wants to move, it does give the owning club room for asking for however much they want for the player.  It’s a hard thing to wrangle mate, but for me players should be forced to respect those contracts and that any early move within the contract length should be beneficial to the club.

[Inverted]

20 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

The problem for the players where reducing a possible maximum length of time a contract could be made for is that they’d (the players and their respective agents) would have less leverage to negotiate massive signing fees and salaries.  As things stand, clubs want to put the maximum timespan permitted because even though they understand that this means very little of the player suddenly wants to move, it does give the owning club room for asking for however much they want for the player.  It’s a hard thing to wrangle mate, but for me players should be forced to respect those contracts and that any early move within the contract length should be beneficial to the club.

But as mentioned this would make players resist signing long contracts, and instead there would merely be a load of players signing 2-3 yr deals, allowing their contracts to run down to a year, and pressuring clubs to either sell them for an at best moderate fee, or lose them for nothing. 

 

[SirBalon]

Just now, Inverted said:

But as mentioned this would make players resist signing long contracts, and instead there would merely be a load of players signing 2-3 yr deals, allowing their contracts to run down to a year, and pressuring clubs to either sell them for an at best moderate fee, or lose them for nothing. 

 

But the shorter the deal, the less money a player can demand because the interests are lowered for the club.  Players have “professionals” running them as a business these days but top clubs also have the best advisors and financial accountants money can buy... As things stand, both parties win although for me it should go further by demanding all the power go to the club while the player is under the obligations he signed on the dotted line for.

[Inverted]

2 minutes ago, SirBalon said:

But the shorter the deal, the less money a player can demand because the interests are lowered for the club.  Players have “professionals” running them as a business these days but top clubs also have the best advisors and financial accountants money can buy... As things stand, both parties win although for me it should go further by demanding all the power go to the club while the player is under the obligations he signed on the dotted line for.

But also consider that if a player is moving to a club on a free there are changes in the whole dynamic. 

1 - the receiving club isn't paying a transfer fee which justifies the demand of a higher wage.

2 - the pool of potential new clubs is much wider which also strengthens the players bargaining power. Of course if he's demanding a short contract, clubs will try to resist paying high wages, but the player also gains his own kind of leverage in that he can talk to a wide range of clubs and drive up his wage. 

The factors you explain are all true, but there are also some balancing factors. 

[Guest]

Since when was it a bad thing to spend money? They have the money to spend. Do people seriously believe they will lock it up and collect?

The players value's are to be questioned, not the clubs spending money on them.

[SirBalon]

1 minute ago, Inverted said:

But also consider that if a player is moving to a club on a free there are changes in the whole dynamic. 

1 - the receiving club isn't paying a transfer fee which justifies the demand of a higher wage.

2 - the pool of potential new clubs is much wider which also strengthens the players bargaining power. Of course if he's demanding a short contract, clubs will try to resist paying high wages, but the player also gains his own kind of leverage in that he can talk to a wide range of clubs and drive up his wage. 

The factors you explain are all true, but there are also some balancing factors. 

True!

But I think both parties could read it from two different perspectives and overall I think it would complicate life for both, club and player.

Something needs to be done in the contract situation though because it seems it has become meaningless these days.

[Dr. Gonzo]

I just hope we invest it wisely. A like for like replacement is likely going to be an expensive downgrade. It might make more sense to get a top quality CM and better keeper. But now we're flush with cash from this so prices are likely to be retarded unless we've been working on deals as this one was going through.

A bit of a derailment on a season where I think we've shown improvement and we have a tough fight ahead of us.

But at least the fucking saga is over. And a new least favourite non-English side.

[Burning Gold]

1 minute ago, Dr. Gonzo said:

I just hope we invest it wisely. A like for like replacement is likely going to be an expensive downgrade. It might make more sense to get a top quality CM and better keeper. But now we're flush with cash from this so prices are likely to be retarded unless we've been working on deals as this one was going through.

A bit of a derailment on a season where I think we've shown improvement and we have a tough fight ahead of us.

But at least the fucking saga is over. And a new least favourite non-English side.

Can't really get my head around how people are only now realising what a bunch of shithouses Barcelona are, but better late than never I guess

[Inverted]

https://www.liverpoolfc.com/news/first-team/286597-jurgen-klopp-on-philippe-coutinho-transfer

Klopp' made a statement on the transfer, mostly quite positive on Coutinho, but one line sounds like it might be a hint that he was unhappy with how he handled it. Might be overthinking it but the words stood out. 

“It is no secret that Philippe has wanted this move to happen since July, when Barcelona first made their interest known. Philippe was insistent with me, the owners and even his teammates this was a move he was desperate to make happen". 

 

[Cicero]

Guess he really wanted to play with Messi

[The Artful Dodger]

Too much money to turn down, still could derail their season.

[SirBalon]

7 minutes ago, Teso dos Bichos said:

Arthur's price just went up considerably... If this joke of a club is willing to pay that for cou, sky is the fucking limit now.

 

From what I understand the Arthur interest wouldn't be for now anyhow, it would be for the summer if he continues to grow.  All the same, Barcelona aren't the only club interested in him as both Real and PSG also have scouts out there now. If the price grows for Barcelona, it grows for the rest and that could price him out of any negotiation because until he comes to Europe he will always be an experiment.

[Dr. Gonzo]

24 minutes ago, Burning Gold said:

Can't really get my head around how people are only now realising what a bunch of shithouses Barcelona are, but better late than never I guess

I realised it during the Fabregas saga. And again when Pepe Reina had his head turned then they signed someone else. But with the Coutinho shite giving us just a taste of what Arsenal went through for years. At least we got an outrageous fee, but it still harms our hopes for this season.

[Bluewolf]

Well that's the end of that saga... 

Pool getting their moneys worth and who can blame them, Prices just seem to be getting higher and higher for players.. Not sure how this is going to affect Liverpool's season overall but not yet being the finished article already I don't think it will be a great thing.. not this season at least and it will now depend on how they spend that remaining money. It might seem like a lot but bearing in mind they have just shelled out half that on one defender already I should imagine they don't have as much to play with as some might think... 

[Carnivore Chris]

I haven't really said anything on this matter(if anything at all) as it was one of those daft sagas that was going on and on, but since it's over now, I will comment. I personally think certain board members were out of order in the summer, although most of the stuff said by players is usually quoted from interviews and let's be honest, players aren't exactly the most intelligent of people in general. It's easy to get them to say what you want in order to sell stories. With this said, I don't think the club have really done much wrong in January, although I feel for Liverpool as I've always respected them and Coutinho was one of their stars, in what is one of the most eye-catching sides in the league. They now have a ridiculous amount of money to spend but January isn't the easiest of times to spend it in considering that nobody wants to sell, plus everyone club in the world now know that Liverpool have a shitload to spend.

Is Coutinho needed is the main question? I would say so as a player of that quality is needed at any club. Iniesta isn't getting any younger either and I think the idea is to slowly bleed him into the attacking midfield role. Him being cup-tied in the Champions league also means that players such as Iniesta can rest before every single champions league fixture, which is what he needs if you ask me. He can't play 90 minutes every week anymore. Coutinho shouldn't take long to adapt either as he's already familiar with Spanish football after his loan spell at Espanyol and will likely play both in attack and as an attacking midfielder, before eventually taking over from Iniesta. This is the plan I believe.

This is also one for the near future and it does look quite bright when you think of the ages of Ter Stegen, Semedo, Umtiti, Dembele, Coutinho, Sergi Roberto, then promising players in the likes of Aleña, who looks very good for his age. Arnaiz, who has been promoted from Barça B) is also another player and Yerry Mina looks to have just been signed.

The most surprising has been the turnaround. In the summer, it was an absolute embarrassment. Neymar left, nobody really came in, Messi and Iniesta hadn't had their contracts renewed yet, Paulinho was signed, who everyone thought was going to offer nothing, Real Madrid won the SuperCopa with ease and it seemed like a dark period was about to form. Since then though, Dembele has been signed, Semedo looks like a player who was the right type of buy, Paulinho has done very well, Coutinho is on his way, Messi and Iniesta have had their contracts renewed and of course, the team have gone undefeated in La Liga, the Champs League and Copa Del Rey.

 

25 minutes ago, Teso dos Bichos said:

Arthur's price just went up considerably... If this joke of a club is willing to pay that for cou, sky is the fucking limit now.

 

It was the Pogba and Lukaku deals which changed everything to be honest.

Neymar was always going to cost atleast 200 when 2 far inferior players than him went for about 90 million, or whatever it was, each.

 

[The Artful Dodger]

All the Barcelona gimps on this forum chopping and changing is hilarious. You’re not Barcelona fans you’re from fucking England you tits.

[RandoEFC+]

54 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said:

All the Barcelona gimps on this forum chopping and changing is hilarious. You’re not Barcelona fans you’re from fucking England you tits.

Thank God I'm not the only one who finds this so confusing and weird.

[Spike]

3 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Thank God I'm not the only one who finds this so confusing and weird.

Gloryhunting is confusing and weird!? 

[Carnivore Chris]

30 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Thank God I'm not the only one who finds this so confusing and weird.

Which part of Liverpool is the Isle of Man in?

 

[El Profesor]

2 hours ago, SirBalon said:

From what I understand the Arthur interest wouldn't be for now anyhow, it would be for the summer if he continues to grow.  All the same, Barcelona aren't the only club interested in him as both Real and PSG also have scouts out there now. If the price grows for Barcelona, it grows for the rest and that could price him out of any negotiation because until he comes to Europe he will always be an experiment.

In Brazil, pretty much everyone expect Yerri Mina to be a Barcelona player before the window closes. That would mean that all non-EU spots would be occupied, leaving Arthur out of question for the time being.

Since the non-EU spot question isn´t easy to be solved, another club could try strike a deal with Grêmio.  It´ll be interesting to see if the market for him develops in this transfer window. It doesn´t look probable at the moment. 

[SirBalon]

16 minutes ago, El_Loco said:

In Brazil, pretty much everyone expect Yerri Mina to be a Barcelona player before the window closes. That would mean that all non-EU spots would be occupied, leaving Arthur out of question for the time being.

Since the non-EU spot question isn´t easy to be solved, another club could try strike a deal with Grêmio.  It´ll be interesting to see if the market for him develops in this transfer window. It doesn´t look probable at the moment. 

I’d like Arsenal to get him so as to replace Özil or play in the massive hole Cazorla left since his injury which seems will make him retire.