Other Matches - Wednesday 26th December, 2018

[Rick]

Was Salah's dive embarrassing? Yes. Is he the first to do it? No. 

Every team has their share of players that take advantage of any contact in the box. I hope Klopp collars him for it, but it's unlikely. 

[LFCMadLad]

21 minutes ago, Rick said:

Was Salah's dive embarrassing? Yes. Is he the first to do it? No. 

Every team has their share of players that take advantage of any contact in the box. I hope Klopp collars him for it, but it's unlikely. 

No doubt it will be Klopps fault. Everything is on here 

I just hope he gave Mo a big hug!

[Stan]

37 minutes ago, Rick said:

Was Salah's dive embarrassing? Yes. Is he the first to do it? No. 

Every team has their share of players that take advantage of any contact in the box. I hope Klopp collars him for it, but it's unlikely. 

Doesn't matter if he's the first to do it. He should get the same punishment as any other player who has dived that has gone unpunished during the match (Niasse and Lanzini the only other 2 so far to get retrospective bans for diving I think). 

 

[Inverted]

4 minutes ago, Stan said:

Doesn't matter if he's the first to do it. He should get the same punishment as any other player who has dived that has gone unpunished during the match (Niasse and Lanzini the only other 2 so far to get retrospective bans for diving I think). 

 

The rules only provide that diving can be punished if the ref is deceived. "Diving" to draw attention to a foul isn't diving as far as the rules are concerned. 

Not sure where anyone is getting this talk of a dive. It's very rare that players choose to stay up when they're fouled. 

[DeadLinesman]

Surely people talking about contact means actual contact with the legs though? Remember the last time your mate tapped you on the shoulder and your legs gave way? 

Me neither......

[DeadLinesman]

15 hours ago, CaaC - John said:

 

£200millon in January ought to do it. I can see petrol prices going up in February.

[Inverted]

1 minute ago, DeadLinesman said:

Surely people talking about contact mean actual contact with the legs though? Remember the last time your mate tapped you on the shoulder and your legs gave way? 

Me neither......

I mean a pull can theoretically bring you down. Same way a mistimed slide challenge or a shoulder bump can.

If it doesn't have the force to bring you down, in all of those cases you can choose to persevere, or you can go down to force the ref to acknowledge the contact. 

[DeadLinesman]

2 minutes ago, Inverted said:

I mean a pull can theoretically bring you down. Same way a mistimed slide challenge or a shoulder bump can.

If it doesn't have the force to bring you down, in all of those cases you can choose to persevere, or you can go down to force the ref to acknowledge the contact. 

There was no pull on Salah though? He was literally touched on the arm. He needs to see a neurological consultant ASAP if that touch makes him fall over. Pulling an arm can throw players off balance, absolutely agree. However, that’s just not the case with Salah yesterday. It was, in my opinion, a 100% dive.

[LFCMike]

FUME INCOMING

 

[DeadLinesman]

10 hours ago, LFCMadLad said:

Same as all the other tards moaning about us getting a penalty when we have had the least amount of penalties awarded at Anfield since the Premiere League was invented. 

I'm loving all this hate though  wait when we beat Arsenal and City in our next two games! It will go through the roof 

I’d love to see the stats on that, because you’ve been awarded 147 penalties since the Premier League began, the most of any team. That’s a lot of diving away from home 

 

2 minutes ago, LFCMike said:

FUME INCOMING

 

Everyone knew he wouldn’t be, so you can’t be upset really. Just proves what a joke the FA panel really is.

[CaaC (John)+]

 

[CaaC (John)+]

1 hour ago, DeadLinesman said:

There was no pull on Salah though? He was literally touched on the arm. He needs to see a neurological consultant ASAP if that touch makes him fall over. Pulling an arm can throw players off balance, absolutely agree. However, that’s just not the case with Salah yesterday. It was, in my opinion, a 100% dive.

 

 

[RandoEFC+]

Yeah and I look forward to the same sanction being applied when David Silva, Harry Kane or (to prove I'm not being biased) Wayne Rooney do the same thing.

This is absolutely pathetic. Not because Niasse didn't dive because he did (though there was contact), but because you see dives worse than that every weekend and nothing gets done about it. Don't get me started on when players deliberately make sure the defender catches their trailing leg and go down like a sack of potatoes which is just as bad as diving whatever anyone says.

From an actual non-Everton footballing perspective I'm glad he's been pulled up on it but I'll be absolutely fuming if one of the media darlings like Loftus-Cheek at the moment for example does the same thing next week (which lets be honest, almost every attacking player would have done in the same circumstances) and they don't get the same treatment.

These were my thoughts on the Niasse ban at the time. For information, the last one of these bans to be dished out was just before Christmas last year for Manuel Lanzini. You can come away from this with a few conclusions:

A) Diving that successfully deceives the referee has been completely eradicated from the English game thanks to the FA dishing out bans to Oumar Niasse and Manuel Lanzini last summer and/or thanks to referees being so much better now that they've caught up and no longer get deceived by diving.

B) Diving still happens every weekend in almost every Premier League football match, the FA simply couldn't be arsed to come up with a clear system to actually deal with it consistently.

C) The FA went after a couple of easy targets like Oumar Niasse and Manuel Lanzini to make it look like they were doing something because they're too incompetent to actually successfully tackle simulation in the Premier League.

Bottom line is, if there have been zero incidents of simulation that haven't been dealt with on the pitch by the referee, then either diving isn't a problem and they can get rid of the panel, or diving is a problem and the panel do absolutely fuck all about it.

 

Also, I feel like I should point out to the Liverpool fans that you won't lose your six point lead at the top if you admit that that was a clear dive from Salah. And don't come back with some "I'm not denying that but, but, but" bullshit. If ever there was an incident where a player won a penalty by deceiving the referee, you're looking at it right there. Contact does not equal a foul. Every team in the league cheats in some shape or form basically every game, but you do yourself a disservice as fans if you so blindly cry about it when other teams do it (Kane, Alli at Anfield anyone? Dominic Calvert-Lewin?) but can't admit it when one of your star players does it as well.

[MUFC]

Pundits and media went into KDB masturbation over drive when he returned from injury, they have lost both games since his return.

[Stan]

1 hour ago, MUFC said:

Pundits and media went into KDB masturbation over drive when he returned from injury, they have lost both games since his return.

He played last week against us in the cup and he scored, then it went to penalties and they won... 

[Dan+]

I personally couldn't give a shit about our own players diving, no point playing by the rules when no-one else has to as we ultimately gain nothing. Until the FA or wider footballing authorities actually try and cut it out then we're just cutting off our nose to spite our face. The fact people have fell for pundits trying to legitimise things like Salah's dive yesterday is staggering, they're all laughing at you. Rando was spot on in that the FA picked two very easy targets to make an example of to make it look like they were doing something. What's happened since? Gray got away with a scandalous one for us against Man City in the cup and I think even that's England U21 player bias.

Nothing will change though. Why would they compromise having the big players playing when they rely on them to be a success.

[Honey Honey]

Once VAR comes in conversations will change somewhat.

 

[Stan]

4 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

Once VAR comes in conversations will change somewhat.

 

That'll probably eradicate diving more as opposed to the FA's attempts to bring in retrospective action.

[Harry]

2 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

Once VAR comes in conversations will change somewhat.

 

Only if all decisions will be reviewed and penalties awarded even in situations where the attacking player doesn't go to ground....

Diving is a weapon that a skillful attacking player can deploy against a thuggish defender that had been getting away with nigglng fouls all night...

I'm not in favor of it but it becomes very one sided if it's taken away. 

[Dan+]

2 minutes ago, Stan said:

That'll probably eradicate diving more as opposed to the FA's attempts to bring in retrospective action.

Doubt it. You've still got people trying to legitimise it.

[Stan]

Just now, Dan said:

Doubt it. You've still got people trying to legitimise it.

What I meant is that it can be looked at there and then, with referees making a decision in the moment as opposed to someone looking back at it and seeing the reaction from media/fans and being swayed by that, and vice-versa. 

[The Artful Dodger]

People seem to chop and change what diving is by the day. I've seen plenty on here say if there is contact 'they have a right to go down', bollocks in my view. Thing is people are not consistent in it and don't criticise there own team like they do others. 

On the Salah one, personally think he is fouled actually, the player clearly grabs his arm but his reaction is an equal misdeed and therefore ref should have just played on. 

[RandoEFC+]

Just watched Dermot Gallagher try and justify why there's a "clear difference" between Salah's dive and the ones Niasse and Lanzini got done for. Embarrassing. If you're going to call such subtle differences significant then you're literally just making it up as you go along, shock horror.

What struck me about the Niasse and Lanzini ones is that they were dives but there was at least contact. You see dives without a jot of contact every weekend and none of those have been punished yet.

It's also still beyond retarded that if you get caught diving by the referee, i.e. it was really fucking obvious, you get a yellow card, so ignoring other bookings, you have to get caught clearly diving in five separate matches (or twice in the same match) to get a ONE match ban. If it's a less obvious dive and you get caught retrospectively, you only have to do that once and you get a TWO match ban.

Its a mess. Ridiculous.

[Dan+]

I'm surprised more isn't made of the fact managers get fines for criticising referees as well. It's disgraceful. The entire situation is a mess, referees aren't helped in any way in this either. VAR may help but won't actually solve everything, as we can see now.

[Dave]

3 hours ago, Dan said:

I'm surprised more isn't made of the fact managers get fines for criticising referees as well. It's disgraceful. 

It's tactical. Alex Ferguson was the king of this and the likes of Don Jose followed. They know if they slate a referee one week for something thats 50/50 in a game they'll get a 25k fine at a disciplinary hearing where they make no representations. That 25k has won them the next game. They know the referee they get the Saturday after that will be a lot more hesitant to give decisions against them because they don't want their name plastered over the tabloid for the next week. It's 25k for 3 points.