Premier League 2023/24 Gameweek 17 - 15-17th December, 2023

[Mel81x+]

I'm just glad we didn't lose this game today. At one point it looked like they were trying and then just gave up which is good considering the final result. This team has a bit more ways to go for me to call them true title challengers. Are they exceeding expectations? Certainly. But is this a team that can clinch a title? I am not so sure about that. Teams around have been floundering more than a dominant display by Liverpool. 

[6666]

1 hour ago, Stan said:

Nunez has half a brain. One of those strikers where you think Liverpool could improve on if they want to become that world-class side again. Reminds me of Jesus for Arsenal. They're both good, but are they good enough for the sides they're at?

I wouldn't say they're similar at all. Jesus fits our style extremely well and always looks in control of what he's doing whereas you never know if Nunez is gonna do something good or something embarrassing. He's just not a penalty box striker.

I'd say Jesus is more similar to Firmino and Liverpool didn't do too bad with him.

[Lucas]

14 minutes ago, LFCMike said:

It feels much worse because everyone built it up that is was gonna be Liverpool thrashing United, even their own fans. Football doesn't always work out like that though. If Bournemouth had come here and played like that and got a 0-0 it wouldn't feel anywhere near as bad

I'd agree with that, not heard one person acknowledge in the build up that it wouldn't be anything but a thrashing.

Think it's also important to gain some perspective. Couple games recently (Fulham, Palace) where you've got three points from late goals and those results could easily have gone against you.

These things happen. Imagine if Hojland scores that chance, could have been worse.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Lucas

[DeadLinesman]

45 minutes ago, Rick said:

Can’t tell me to calm down after that performance against the worst Utd team that’s visited Anfield in the last decade. We were atrocious, no doubt about it. 

United lost to some of the worst Liverpool teams in recent memory when they were at the height of their powers in the mid 00’s. It happens.

[Rick]

6 minutes ago, Lucas said:

I'd agree with that, not heard one person acknowledge in the build up that it wouldn't be anything but a thrashing.

Think it's also important to gain some perspective. Couple games recently (Fulham, Palace) where you've got three points from late goals and those results could easily have gone against you.

These things happen. Imagine if Hojland scores that chance, could have been worse.

I predicted this sort of game myself, but I still expected us to win. There were enough moments to win that game, we just made idiotic decisions in the final 3rd. Utd didn’t dig in and pull of some defensive masterclass, we were just shit. 

[Lucas]

8 minutes ago, Rick said:

I predicted this sort of game myself, but I still expected us to win. There were enough moments to win that game, we just made idiotic decisions in the final 3rd. Utd didn’t dig in and pull of some defensive masterclass, we were just shit. 

Personally from what I've seen recently, I think being bluntly honest, your results have papered over your performances.

I wasn't that impressed with that Luton and Sheffield United games the other week for example, and the Palace one wasn't a great watch either.

Certainly feels like you've got another gear to go up for sure if you're to go on and win it.

Edited December 17, 2023 by Lucas

[Rick]

1 minute ago, Lucas said:

Personally from what I've seen recently, I think being bluntly honest, your results have papered over your performances.

I wasn't that impressed with that Luton and Sheffield United games the other week for example, and the Palace one wasn't a great watch either.

Certainly feels like you've got another gear to go up for sure if you're to go on and win it.

Fully agree with this. We are going through a patch of unconvincing performances. But, as you said we have a year to go up, and we need to see it next weekend.  

[LFCMike]

19 minutes ago, Rick said:

I predicted this sort of game myself, but I still expected us to win. There were enough moments to win that game, we just made idiotic decisions in the final 3rd. Utd didn’t dig in and pull of some defensive masterclass, we were just shit. 

Completely disagree that United didn't dig in, they obviously did otherwise we'd have scored. Not saying it was a defensive masterclass of Mourinho proportions but you have to give them credit as you would if a bottom half of the table side played how they did

[Danny]

Honestly Watkins and Villa need to clear this up because the vagueness of this whole situation is completely killing his standing at the club.

I don’t believe that a player ever owes his entire career to a club but Watkins would have struggled to find a club that would have given him the development time that we did. If it was just general stick then he’s overreacted and ruined his standing amongst fans who still love him, if it’s something much more serious then that needs to be explained because Villa are asking for a fan to be investigated yet no one will say what for.

Just a confusing mess to add to what seemed to have become quite a chaotic game.

[MUFC]

Did you see how many counters we had? There were a few where we out numbered them. But all broke down because it was Antony leading the counters. He just kept cutting back on his right and the chances fell through. If it was someone with an ounce of quality in the final third we could have made something out of them.

[Stan]

9 minutes ago, Danny said:

Honestly Watkins and Villa need to clear this up because the vagueness of this whole situation is completely killing his standing at the club.

I don’t believe that a player ever owes his entire career to a club but Watkins would have struggled to find a club that would have given him the development time that we did. If it was just general stick then he’s overreacted and ruined his standing amongst fans who still love him, if it’s something much more serious then that needs to be explained because Villa are asking for a fan to be investigated yet no one will say what for.

Just a confusing mess to add to what seemed to have become quite a chaotic game.

Seen that he said it was one particular fan giving him abuse all game.

[Stan]

1 hour ago, 6666 said:

I wouldn't say they're similar at all. Jesus fits our style extremely well and always looks in control of what he's doing whereas you never know if Nunez is gonna do something good or something embarrassing. He's just not a penalty box striker.

I'd say Jesus is more similar to Firmino and Liverpool didn't do too bad with him.

The similarity in the sense that is he good enough to get you enough goals as your main striker to win a league...?

[Danny]

10 minutes ago, Stan said:

Seen that he said it was one particular fan giving him abuse all game.

Yeah it’s a weird one. No one knows what was said and a mess has been made out of all of it. Takes something to overshadow VAR lol

[Reluctant Striker]

19 minutes ago, Danny said:

Honestly Watkins and Villa need to clear this up because the vagueness of this whole situation is completely killing his standing at the club.

I don’t believe that a player ever owes his entire career to a club but Watkins would have struggled to find a club that would have given him the development time that we did. If it was just general stick then he’s overreacted and ruined his standing amongst fans who still love him, if it’s something much more serious then that needs to be explained because Villa are asking for a fan to be investigated yet no one will say what for.

Just a confusing mess to add to what seemed to have become quite a chaotic game.

Yes, you would kind of hope the 1 fan Watkins seemed to point out had been doing or saying something really bad. He did seem to sigh a bit when he realised he'd maybe started up a shoving match.

Seen Unai say the general behaviour should be better. And I'd be expecting better behaviour. As a fan, it would feel like a best behaviour away game, given Dean Smith, Ollie Watkins & Ezri Konsa. I'd understand it more if it had been Villa playing at Man City or Burnley. But, who knows who had been saying what to who. Especially when you add in Ben Mee (BBC MotD choice for a Villa only Sunday pundit a few weeks back.. Near enough Robbie Savage or Micah Richards)

[Danny]

11 minutes ago, Reluctant Striker said:

Yes, you would kind of hope the 1 fan Watkins seemed to point out had been doing or saying something really bad. He did seem to sigh a bit when he realised he'd maybe started up a shoving match.

Seen Unai say the general behaviour should be better. And I'd be expecting better behaviour. As a fan, it would feel like a best behaviour away game, given Dean Smith, Ollie Watkins & Ezri Konsa. I'd understand it more if it had been Villa playing at Man City or Burnley. But, who knows who had been saying what to who. Especially when you add in Ben Mee (BBC MotD choice for a Villa only Sunday pundit a few weeks back.. Near enough Robbie Savage or Micah Richards)

Yeah Frank was disappointed with some of our behaviour too. Glad to hear it tbh, not often you hear coaches taking responsibility in that way.

Tbh we were only ever a stepping stone for Konsa but yeah with the Dean Smith link too, it’s a strange one.

[Stan]

6 hours ago, Danny said:

Sounds like the ref has had a shocker and we should also have had a pen

Watched the highlights. 

Can't agree that you should have had a penalty. Mee/McGinn both holding each other. 

Mee is a red card - studs up, over the ball, on side of the shin. Correctly upgraded. 

Maupay makes the most of contact and not enough for a penalty. 

Coote is a weak ref and game boiled over, but not sure why or where he's had such a shocker. 

[Danny]

20 minutes ago, Stan said:

Watched the highlights. 

Can't agree that you should have had a penalty. Mee/McGinn both holding each other. 

Mee is a red card - studs up, over the ball, on side of the shin. Correctly upgraded. 

Maupay makes the most of contact and not enough for a penalty. 

Coote is a weak ref and game boiled over, but not sure why or where he's had such a shocker. 

Not sure what more you want from Konsa for a foul, no intention of getting the ball, his thigh goes straight through Maupay and sends him to the ground.

I get Mee not being given more, but Mcginn had his arms wrapped round Mee’s neck/shoulder pushing him back down to the ground.

Martinez should have had two yellows too but thats by the by.

Poor officiating aside, we should have won that early on with the chances we created and I think thats the most frustrating thing. Plus side to today is we played an in form Villa with a very weakened side and were the better team creating better chances 11vs11. Some really good squad building from the club considering we still have 6 guaranteed starters out of the team and a couple super subs not fit either. On to the next one, hopefully pick up some points and momentum in time for the return of players in the new year.

[Reluctant Striker]

The big positive for Villa was winning without Douglas Luiz. And Tielemans, who has played DM in Europe. We all hear what happens when Man City are without Rodri.

If Villa are top at Christmas, which they very easily could be, they have to be considered title contenders. People may still expect Man City, Liverpool, Arsenal or even someone else to come through by the end. They may even expect a few clubs will all chip in at some stage to buy the best of Villa, piece by piece. But those intent on ignoring Villa will increasingly look like a football themed spec savers commercial.

[Fairy In Boots]

10 hours ago, Danny said:

Honestly Watkins and Villa need to clear this up because the vagueness of this whole situation is completely killing his standing at the club.

I don’t believe that a player ever owes his entire career to a club but Watkins would have struggled to find a club that would have given him the development time that we did. If it was just general stick then he’s overreacted and ruined his standing amongst fans who still love him, if it’s something much more serious then that needs to be explained because Villa are asking for a fan to be investigated yet no one will say what for.

Just a confusing mess to add to what seemed to have become quite a chaotic game.

Yeah it is vague, I think it was more to back Ollie out of the gate. I agree it’s weird.
If it’s racist abuse then they should say that, but on the flip side it could tar the whole fanbase so I get the logic of not going into detail. Headlines would just be “Watkins racially abused at Brentford” when the statement specifically says it respects the majority of Brentford fans 

[Stan]

1 hour ago, Fairy In Boots said:

Yeah it is vague, I think it was more to back Ollie out of the gate. I agree it’s weird.
If it’s racist abuse then they should say that, but on the flip side it could tar the whole fanbase so I get the logic of not going into detail. Headlines would just be “Watkins racially abused at Brentford” when the statement specifically says it respects the majority of Brentford fans 

Watkins said it wasn't racist and he wouldn't make it about that if it wasn't. He seemed genuine in his interview and it'd be pretty weird to say it wasn't racist abuse if it was.

 

8 hours ago, Danny said:

Not sure what more you want from Konsa for a foul, no intention of getting the ball, his thigh goes straight through Maupay and sends him to the ground.

I get Mee not being given more, but Mcginn had his arms wrapped round Mee’s neck/shoulder pushing him back down to the ground.

Martinez should have had two yellows too but thats by the by.

Poor officiating aside, we should have won that early on with the chances we created and I think thats the most frustrating thing. Plus side to today is we played an in form Villa with a very weakened side and were the better team creating better chances 11vs11. Some really good squad building from the club considering we still have 6 guaranteed starters out of the team and a couple super subs not fit either. On to the next one, hopefully pick up some points and momentum in time for the return of players in the new year.

I'll have to watch it again but looked like two players coming together and Maupay initiating contact himself.

Mee had his hands over McGinn as well though, which is why I guess they couldn't give it either way.

Agree about Martinez; he winds everyone in the stadium up and he's a master of it. The time-wasting, play-acting, theatrics. It does need to be punished, that kind of stuff. The play-acting should definitely be retrospectively punished if that is going to be eradicated from the game (and it should). The reaction from Maupay's little shoulder barge deserves an Oscar. 

 

[Devil]

On 17/12/2023 at 20:29, MUFC said:

Did you see how many counters we had? There were a few where we out numbered them. But all broke down because it was Antony leading the counters. He just kept cutting back on his right and the chances fell through. If it was someone with an ounce of quality in the final third we could have made something out of them.

They completely ignore the fact we were a  Hojlund goal away from the media claiming we pulled off a defensive smash and grab masterclass.

It wasn't pretty in fairness, but given our form of late we couldn't afford and absolute hammering again at Anfield.