England National Team Discussion

[Danny]

Mostly it’s a pretty good squad with wide variety. The likes of Dunk, Colwill, Tomori, Guehi, Gallagher, Eze, Maddison, Nketiah and Wilson are good inclusions, gives the squad a boost and allows us to build pathways for players who haven’t been included that much so far.

The team I expect to see and players in brackets I’d like to see:

Pickford

Walker - Dunk - Maguire(Colwill) - Chilwell

Henderson(Trent) - Rice

Saka - Bellingham - Grealish

Kane

 

 

[Cicero]

No Sterling. Wow. 

[Dr. Gonzo]

34 minutes ago, Stan said:

How the fuck are Phillips and Maguire in, when they've not played a minute this season? 

Or Jordan Beheaderson playing in a fancy league one equivalent 

[Stan]

22 minutes ago, Cicero said:

No Sterling. Wow. 

Southgate says it was because the current group of players had a good connection and it would be hard to oust the current set of attacking midfielders behind Kane...

[Reluctant Striker]

It is a sad state of affairs that Maguire, Phillips & J Henderson are still in. 

But the obvious replacements do not exactly spring readily to mind. Perhaps Konsa, Ward-Prowse & Loftus Cheek ? Not exactly the next promising generation though.

Plenty of full backs still around. Plenty of wing-CAMs. Watkins being kept out. But, midfielders in particular do seem few & far between.

I guess the positive is that the midfield 3 for the next few tournaments should be Rice, Bellingham & one other. There is talk of TAA being used in midfield. If Maddison continues dropping deep for Spurs, does he come into it?

But the days when England mens side is asking players to play out of position. Or looking to the Championship really do seem to be nearing. The England side itself becoming the place some players breakthrough. What many of the more concerned have been worried of for a while.

[Rick]

Southgate is a wanker. Got players like Ward Prowse sitting at home, meanwhile Phillips gets a call up despite doing fuck all for months. This is why it’s hard to give a fuck about the national team right now, because the players aren’t being picked on merit and there will be plenty of great players left at home when the euro’s come around. 

[Danny]

1 hour ago, Rick said:

Southgate is a wanker. Got players like Ward Prowse sitting at home, meanwhile Phillips gets a call up despite doing fuck all for months. This is why it’s hard to give a fuck about the national team right now, because the players aren’t being picked on merit and there will be plenty of great players left at home when the euro’s come around. 

So Nketiah, Eze, Maddison, Wilson, Saka, Kane, Foden, Rice, Bellingham, Colwill, Dunk, Guehi, Tomori, Chilwell, Johnstone, Pickford aren’t players who are in good form and have been picked for that?

Honestly it’s such bullshit that he doesn’t pick players on form. He has justified Phillips’ inclusion and quite fairly, we only have two players who can play as a single pivot, Declan Rice and Kalvin Phillips. James Ward-Prowse would not be competing with them for a starting position because he is not a defensive midfielder, he would be competing with Gallagher, Bellingham, Maddison and Henderson.

Southgate is the most successful England manager of our lifetime and has achieved that by consistently blending new talent/performers with consistent performers. It was Southgate who introduced Maguire, Rice, Phillips, Mount, Grealish, Saka, Sancho and Foden into the team after performing well enough at club level.

He’s now introduced Trent, Guehi, Maddison, Tomori and Toney into first team action too.

[Whiskey]

7 minutes ago, Danny said:

So Nketiah, Eze, Maddison, Wilson, Saka, Kane, Foden, Rice, Bellingham, Colwill, Dunk, Guehi, Tomori, Chilwell, Johnstone, Pickford aren’t players who are in good form and have been picked for that?

Honestly it’s such bullshit that he doesn’t pick players on form. He has justified Phillips’ inclusion and quite fairly, we only have two players who can play as a single pivot, Declan Rice and Kalvin Phillips. James Ward-Prowse would not be competing with them for a starting position because he is not a defensive midfielder, he would be competing with Gallagher, Bellingham, Maddison and Henderson.

Southgate is the most successful England manager of our lifetime and has achieved that by consistently blending new talent/performers with consistent performers. It was Southgate who introduced Maguire, Rice, Phillips, Mount, Grealish, Saka, Sancho and Foden into the team after performing well enough at club level.

He’s now introduced Trent, Guehi, Maddison, Tomori and Toney into first team action too.

It's just fashionable to hate on Southgate.

[Reluctant Striker]

2 hours ago, Danny said:

So Nketiah, Eze, Maddison, Wilson, Saka, Kane, Foden, Rice, Bellingham, Colwill, Dunk, Guehi, Tomori, Chilwell, Johnstone, Pickford aren’t players who are in good form and have been picked for that?

Honestly it’s such bullshit that he doesn’t pick players on form. He has justified Phillips’ inclusion and quite fairly, we only have two players who can play as a single pivot, Declan Rice and Kalvin Phillips. James Ward-Prowse would not be competing with them for a starting position because he is not a defensive midfielder, he would be competing with Gallagher, Bellingham, Maddison and Henderson.

Southgate is the most successful England manager of our lifetime and has achieved that by consistently blending new talent/performers with consistent performers. It was Southgate who introduced Maguire, Rice, Phillips, Mount, Grealish, Saka, Sancho and Foden into the team after performing well enough at club level.

He’s now introduced Trent, Guehi, Maddison, Tomori and Toney into first team action too.

The biggest problem for England, for Southgate & whoever comes next, is when certain clubs let 3 England internationals leave. And replace them with Japanese, Argentinean & Hungarian internationals.

It's been happening gradually over the last 20 to 30 years. And Kalvin Phillips & Harry Maguire are the perfect examples of where it is all going. Villa have a Swedish international goalkeeper as number 2. He still gets picked by Sweden. Every club in the league has had players like that for many many years. Ireland always used to have players you had heard of. The Irish, Welsh & Scots have not had the same club chances to develop that they had in the past.

Gary Neville has often had things to say about it all & gets disagreed with.

I'm fairly sure French, Spanish, German & Italian managers would have a far bigger selection pool.

And for me, it all just leads me much more toward having little interest in following the Man City vs Liverpool vs Arsenal vs maybe, maybe, maybe Man United ! Or the Alan Shearer club. Even Villa's minor accomplishment still leaves me a bit m'eh about the bestest league in the world.

[Reluctant Striker]

Scotland vs England. 150 year anniversary friendly.

Lots more like it again, so far, from England. 2-0 at half time. Largely controlling the game. A number of incisive moments.

Foden with an incredibly quick reaction finish to knock in a Walker shot.

Robertson absolutely gifting Bellingham England's 2nd.

Dunk & Guehi looking comfortable in centre defence.

Bellingham still mostly playing as 10, ahead of Rice & Phillips. Got his gift goal, but a few times when he's dropped deep, he's showing how capable he is of dazzling past opposition players. Or just maintaining possession in a tight pocket.

I do think Rice, Bellingham & 1 other, in more a 1 goes & 1 stays type 3 would better suit. Whether it's TAA, Ward Prowse, Henderson, Maddison or Foden. And Grealish was used there. Ramsey could be used there. Mount? Whoever else breaks through.

[Danny]

4 hours ago, Reluctant Striker said:

Scotland vs England. 150 year anniversary friendly.

Lots more like it again, so far, from England. 2-0 at half time. Largely controlling the game. A number of incisive moments.

Foden with an incredibly quick reaction finish to knock in a Walker shot.

Robertson absolutely gifting Bellingham England's 2nd.

Dunk & Guehi looking comfortable in centre defence.

Bellingham still mostly playing as 10, ahead of Rice & Phillips. Got his gift goal, but a few times when he's dropped deep, he's showing how capable he is of dazzling past opposition players. Or just maintaining possession in a tight pocket.

I do think Rice, Bellingham & 1 other, in more a 1 goes & 1 stays type 3 would better suit. Whether it's TAA, Ward Prowse, Henderson, Maddison or Foden. And Grealish was used there. Ramsey could be used there. Mount? Whoever else breaks through.

I think TAA must be the preferred option behind Bellingham. At least I hope so

[Reluctant Striker]

Good to see Watkins called up. Not a penalty taker, but a good line leader. Could deserve a chance ahead of Nketiah & Wilson, if anything happens to Kane.

Ezri Konsa must wonder why he is always missing out. He must be at least on par with all except Stones.

[Danny]

Watkins is better than Nketiah and Wilson, glad to see him get the call up, looks set to bag 20+ this season. Bowen with a deserved call up too.

I know people will focus on Maguire and Phillips but there is a lot of depth to this England team that has been introduced the last couple of games. The Australia game should be a good run out for the wider squad, shouldn’t need to play as strong a team as we did against Scotland. For Italy I’d like to see something like:

 

Kane

Foden - Bellingham - Saka

Rice - Trent

Trippier - Guehi - Stones - Walker

Pickford

 

 

[Bluebird Hewitt]

There we go. Maguire has spoken.

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/67142612

[Danny]

No Maddison, Dunk, Wilson, Bellingham or Colwill for this.

England's updated squad list

Goalkeepers: Sam Johnstone (Crystal Palace), Jordan Pickford (Everton), Aaron Ramsdale (Arsenal).

Defenders: Marc Guehi (Crystal Palace), Harry Maguire (Manchester United), Fikayi Tomori (AC Milan), Kieran Trippier (Newcastle), Kyle Walker (Manchester City), Rico Lewis (Manchester City), Ezri Konsa (Aston Villa).

Midfielders: Trent Alexander-Arnold (Liverpool), Conor Gallagher (Chelsea), Jordan Henderson (Al-Ettifaq), Kalvin Phillips (Manchester City), Declan Rice (Arsenal), Cole Palmer (Chelsea).

Forwards: Jarrod Bowen (West Ham), Phil Foden (Manchester City), Jack Grealish (Manchester City), Harry Kane (Bayern Munich), Marcus Rashford (Manchester United), Bukayo Saka (Arsenal), Ollie Watkins (Aston Villa).

If we beat Malta then that secures qualification, a top place finish and another smooth qualification. It then gives us some freedom to work with against North Macedonia who whilst we beat 7-0 at Wembley, have proven they are no mugs at their home ground and it may well be a difficult night but regardless we should expect to win.

I've gotta say I'm still struggling with the media narrative around Southgate and who he has decided not to bring into this squad. Looking through that team we have Ramsdale, Guehi, Tomori, Lewis, Konsa, Trent, Gallagher, Palmer, Bowen and Watkins who have all been on the periphery of this team. Why the fuck Sky are doing segments on whether or not James Ward-Prowse should be on the plane is beyond me.

Some overly familiar faces in there are Maguire, Henderson and Phillips. I know this pisses people off, especially people who get a hard on the moment someone in form doesn't get a call up. But the fact is Henderson and Maguire have been key starters for us for the past 3 tournaments and are yet to let us down, have consistently contributed to good runs in major tournament and you need that consistency in the squad. Phillips also the only other number 6 we have alongside Rice and played well against Scotland, and was arguably our player of the tournament behind Kane and Sterling at the Euros. I get their inclusions.

The team I expect us to play versus a team I would like us to play:

Pickford

Walker - Maguire - Guehi - Trippier

Henderson - Rice - Gallagher

Saka - Kane - Foden

 

Foden - Kane - Saka

Gallagher - Rice - Trent

Lewis - Guehi - Tomori - Walker

Pickford

 

 

[Stan]

19 hours ago, Danny said:

Why the fuck Sky are doing segments on whether or not James Ward-Prowse should be on the plane is beyond me.

Very consistent for West Ham and influential for them. What would it take for him to be involved, even to begin in the periphery like those other players? 

When does he get a chance?

[Lucas]

Didn't watch the Malta game and I've not come in to moan at Southgate, Henderson, only winning 2-0 etc.

But fuck me, what a shambles that Wembley Stadium website is. Had an absolute madness trying to secure tickets for the Brazil game in March.

The incompetance of ticket sites these days in the period we are in is a shambles. Thankfully perseversnce paid off and I got some but the pain of getting them was real.

Ticketmaster are complete cunts and top tier when it comes to fucking you over on big events, but I tell you what, Wembley are now up there.

[6666]

So who goes from the winger/attacking midfield positions?

Saka & Foden are certainties I think. After that we're looking at 2 or 3 from Grealish, Maddison, Rashford, Sterling, and Palmer.

[OrangeKhrush]

i think a bad Euros may once and for all end Southgate, absolute dros football.

 

[MUFC]

What would your starting 11 be for Euro 2024?

[Stan]

7 minutes ago, MUFC said:

What would your starting 11 be for Euro 2024?

Pickford

Alexander-Arnold - Maguire - Stones - Chilwell*

Rice

Bellingham - Foden

Saka - Kane - Maddison

 

That LW position is tricky because while Foden could play there, it's not where he is strongest. It's lacking defensively, but you could use Alexander-Arnold as the inverted full-back to add an extra body in midfield?

Shaw would start at LB for now but I think he's injured so there's doubts about if he'll play, otherwise it's Chilwell's spot to lose. 

Right now, there's 4 players that go straight in and just have to be immediately on the team-sheet - Foden, Saka, Kane & Bellingham. They're world-class. 

I know some (and hopefully not Southgate) will include Phillips or Henderson, but there's better players available now to start...

The good thing is though, there's depth in a lot of positions, and hopefully those players could just slot right in - Walker/Trippier for RB; Gallagher in CM, Palmer or Bowen in attacking midfield, Grealish (if he gets his act together) on LW, Watkins is playing very well to be an adequate replacement for Kane. Even players like Colwill or Guehi (if fit) can be options for CB. 

 

[Danny]

 

I think I'd like the below, with Foden and Saka rotating wings and Foden essentially being given freedom to drop centrally. The focus in midfield has to be on Jude Bellingham, by far our best player. I think Trent has had such a great season that we can't leave him out, but I'd like to see him just drift more as a half back almost and let Walker bomb forward and give Saka the freedom to cut in. Then we're still left with Rice playing DM, Trent playing a similar role to what he does at Liverpool and then Foden, Saka and Bellingham just causing problems drifting around and swapping positions.

Honestly I don't think Foden needs to play as a cam, I think he's just at a point now where as long as you give him freedom to attack he will do it from either side of the pitch, and again if you give him the freedom to rotate with Saka and Bellingham, the latter who does find himself in various attacking positions for Madrid, then you're still giving him the chance to play in his favoured positions whilst making it hard for the opposition to mark their man.

Foden - Kane - Saka

Bellingham

Rice - Trent

Chilwell - Guehi - Stones - Walker

Pickford

 

To field a second eleven to show depth. I know Phillips is controversial but the fact remains that England only have two players that can play as a #6 and that's him and Rice, and you need depth in every position. The 23rd player for me would be Ivan Toney, I just think it would be mad not to take arguably the best penalty taker in the league and someone who is a direct replacement for Kane stylistically:

Grealish - Watkins - Bowen

Maddison - Palmer

Phillips

Lewis - Colwill - Dunk - Trippier

Pope

[Cicero]

Pickford

Walker Stones Colwill Trippier

TAA   Rice

Saka Bellingham Foden

Kane

[Reluctant Striker]

Pickford

TAA Konsa Stones Colwill

Rice

Foden Bellingham

Saka Kane Gordon

 

With TAA doing the inverted DM thing, in possesion.

Konsa, Stones & Colwill have all been used to some variation on that. Could equally work with Walker in ahead of TAA & then becomes Stones stepping ahead of Walker Konsa & Colwill.

Saka & Gordon seem to have high energy, for getting back, in addition to contributing going forward.

Pretty much tell Foden & Bellingham to win matches however they can.

I think it's perhaps how we get all of Saka, Foden & Bellingham in the same 11.

[MUFC]

Is it me or does Grealish seem to play well at international competitions?