FINAL - Spain 2-1 England - Sunday 14th July, 2024

[OrangeKhrush]

England a year ago for the world cup had Ben White, Trippier, Walker and James, trent was having a off year for liverpool.   This tournament, Walker and Trippier are leg heavy, Ben White and Southgate clearly have issues and while trent had a better season he is defensively shit and james is eternally broken.

 

 

[MUFC]

It was just a minor change in the second half which changed the game. In the first half both Spanish wingers stayed out wide. They went on the outside which resulted in a foot race. This suited Walker and Shaw who are both quick. The second half the Spanish wingers started to drift infield and float around more. This made them more difficult to pick up and left Englands midfield outnumbered in the middle. Just a minor change without having to make a substitution. 

 

 

[Smiley Culture]

Do England need to win something? I’m not sure where this has come from but international football is different to club level and trophies are harder to come by. 

[Tommy]

lol he even tagged him. 

[couscous]

And just like that it's over.

Now what do I do.

[Devil-Dick Willie]

8 minutes ago, Tommy said:

lol he even tagged him. 

Imagine doing punditry for a team whos LB is old, a bit shite a lot of the time, and always playing on an irregular basis, whos best midfielder is a guy who does the basics well and that's it, whos partners were a right back, a teenager (who turned out a fun find but hardly world class yet) and a guy who's only mode is bombing around, and who has taken no dedicated left edge option to the tournament. A team with deep class in some positions and mediocre players in several others. 

Then imagine slagging off one of the top 3 on paper teams of the tournament because their left back underperformed one season in a team he's not suited too, and a team who underperformed as a unit all season. 
Says it all about English punditry really. Spain can't go all the way because Cucurella is off the boil, but England are favorites (pre tournament) with Shaw, Walker, Guehi, Rice and Mainoo as its BEST starters in those positions. Absurd. And to be fair to Mainoo and Guehi they exceeded expectation!

[MUFC]

Saka had the beating of their full back. Problem was he was too deep most of the game.

[Reluctant Striker]

1 hour ago, Smiley Culture said:

Do England need to win something? I’m not sure where this has come from but international football is different to club level and trophies are harder to come by. 

If you are genuinely looking for reasons to justify the mysterious 'English' dissatisfaction, just totalling up World Cup or Euro's wins since 1990 (when I was first fully aware what was going on & what I was watching)

This was the 18th tournament. Spain 4, Germany 3, France 3, Brazil 2, Italy 2, with 1 each for Portugal, Denmark, Greece & Argentina.

The big leagues are widely considered to be Spanish, German, French, Italian & ...English.

Yes, we're right up there with Netherlands, Sweden, Uruguay & Croatia. But the English league is supposed to be significantly ahead & in among a very different group. There is a case to suggest change is gradually happening, with this current generation. There is a much broader story beyond just the current manager & group of players.

Edited July 15 by Reluctant Striker

[MUFC]

Stories Kane was carrying an injury? If true, this is poor management being played while injured.

[Smiley Culture]

51 minutes ago, Reluctant Striker said:

If you are genuinely looking for reasons to justify the mysterious 'English' dissatisfaction, just totalling up World Cup or Euro's wins since 1990 (when I was first fully aware what was going on & what I was watching)

This was the 18th tournament. Spain 4, Germany 3, France 3, Brazil 2, Italy 2, with 1 each for Portugal, Denmark, Greece & Argentina.

The big leagues are widely considered to be Spanish, German, French, Italian & ...English.

Yes, we're right up there with Netherlands, Sweden, Uruguay & Croatia. But the English league is supposed to be significantly ahead & in among a very different group. There is a case to suggest change is gradually happening, with this current generation. There is a much broader story beyond just the current manager & group of players.

I’m not sure what the leagues have to do with anything. Brazil, Argentina and France are perennial winners and achievers yet nobody across the planet panders to see Arsenal di Sarandi or Bordeaux. 

England have gone from Quarter Finals, if they’re lucky, to becoming a regular at tournaments at the back end of them. I’m not sure winning something is the decider between them and Southgate being deemed a success or not. Southgate’s tenure has been hugely successful, regardless of tournament wins, and should go down as such but there’s this weird God given right to win trophies that’s always been there regardless of how good England have been. 

[MUFC]

Patrice Evra.

[Mel81x+]

3 hours ago, RandoEFC said:

No point playing Alexander-Arnold in this England team. You can be the best crosser in the world but it's useless putting a good ball into the box because Kane will be halfway between the centre circle and the edge of the box jogging vacantly forward rather than getting on the end of anything.

Im surprised he persisted with him knowing full well that he had options who were willing to play in the area for crosses. Putting Toney on along with Watkins felt like an obligation more than a tactical change towards the end.

[Reluctant Striker]

53 minutes ago, Smiley Culture said:

I’m not sure what the leagues have to do with anything. Brazil, Argentina and France are perennial winners and achievers yet nobody across the planet panders to see Arsenal di Sarandi or Bordeaux. 

England have gone from Quarter Finals, if they’re lucky, to becoming a regular at tournaments at the back end of them. I’m not sure winning something is the decider between them and Southgate being deemed a success or not. Southgate’s tenure has been hugely successful, regardless of tournament wins, and should go down as such but there’s this weird God given right to win trophies that’s always been there regardless of how good England have been. 

You do not think the league's have helped produce & refine a whole bunch of the current squad? Who are starting to look a level above previous generations? I have fully backed Southgate. Until now. Yes, it is the best I've known following England. Where Q-final or semi final respectability was as good as it got

But good luck to you for whatever it is you are actually hoping for & would like to see one day. If your view is genuinely that England is pretty much Sweden, what's the fuss ? you will always have this same lack of comprehension for England football fans & their expectations.

[Lucas]

The only thing that's been obvious to me in this tournament is we've produced our better football being a goal down. I don't know why we've needed that to happen, but for whatever reason, suddenly the shackles come off and we play more freely. We up the pace, we force the issue a bit more.

Last night, despite being outplayed, despite being the second best side on the pitch, we actually got ourselves back in the game at 1-1.

That was the moment. The first bit of momentum we had and if we were ever going to win that game, that was where we needed to carry on taking the game to Spain. There was an opportunity there to really take the game to them because we'd upped our tempo and pressure and just scoring the goal from nowhere was a big psychological lift. I think it shocked them us equalising.

But we retreated. We reverted to type, let them come back on to us. We even had the warning from Yamal moments before the winner and still sat off. 

We were very reactionary all tournament and that's what disappoints me most because no one can tell me we don't have the players to dictate games.

[MUFC]

Stories Kane was carrying an injury? If true, this is poor management being played while injured.

[Stan]

1 hour ago, MUFC said:

Stories Kane was carrying an injury? If true, this is poor management being played while injured.

 

11 minutes ago, MUFC said:

Stories Kane was carrying an injury? If true, this is poor management being played while injured.

These stories keep continuing!

 

[Dan+]

It is strange how similar to Rooney Kane has become. Remember Hodgson shoehorning Rooney into the team in midfield in Euro 2016. That Trent midfield business was not dissimilar in this tournament.

The more analysis I read of this tournament the performance the more I wish Slovakia had just beaten us. It's actually annoying this generally abject level served up can now be rebuffed by hiding behind making a final. One of the biggest fluke runs I've ever seen. Forget Greece & Portugal if we'd gone all the way I think it would've been the worst side I've ever seen win a World Cup or Euros.

Even yesterday I've no idea how we kept it to 2-1. It was a hammering.

[Dan+]

3 hours ago, Tommy said:

lol he even tagged him. 

Neville needs calling out more. He's not a great judge.

I'm fed up of hearing pundits with a conflict of interest.

[Dan+]

30 minutes ago, Lucas said:

The only thing that's been obvious to me in this tournament is we've produced our better football being a goal down. I don't know why we've needed that to happen, but for whatever reason, suddenly the shackles come off and we play more freely. We up the pace, we force the issue a bit more.

Last night, despite being outplayed, despite being the second best side on the pitch, we actually got ourselves back in the game at 1-1.

That was the moment. The first bit of momentum we had and if we were ever going to win that game, that was where we needed to carry on taking the game to Spain. There was an opportunity there to really take the game to them because we'd upped our tempo and pressure and just scoring the goal from nowhere was a big psychological lift. I think it shocked them us equalising.

But we retreated. We reverted to type, let them come back on to us. We even had the warning from Yamal moments before the winner and still sat off. 

We were very reactionary all tournament and that's what disappoints me most because no one can tell me we don't have the players to dictate games.

He was lining up Gallagher and Trippier to come on at 1-1 as well. We play like we're Sweden or Norway.

Fluking the final is going to ensure nothing changes as well. It's the same old story with England.

[Coma+]

2 hours ago, Reluctant Striker said:

The big leagues are widely considered to be Spanish, German, French, Italian & ...English.

...But the English league is supposed to be significantly ahead & in among a very different group.

There's no doubt that England have excellent players and they should be benefitting from playing with the best players in the world in their own home league.  Is this just a case of foreign players propping up the league though?

[Michael]

It was a tense final and Williams giving Spain at the start of the 2nd half was deserved. Palmer equalising with that lovely strike gave us hope. But ultimately Oyarzabal scored Spain's 2nd goal late in the game to give the Spaniards the win. In truth and looking at it objectively as possible, Spain deserved the win. Pickford kept us in the final with some great saves for large parts of the game and Spain have played excellently throughout the Euros.

I think every single match that Spain played in was entertaining. They won all their matches playing enjoyable football and in all honesty I think the best team at the Euros won in the end. So congratulations to the Spanish for a much deserved win, I was impressed by the Spanish right from the start of these Euros. 

16 year old Yamal, Dani Olmo, Williams, Fabian, Rodri, Carvajal and Cucurella were all excellent for Spain during the Euros. So yeah, I think the best team deservedly won in the end.

[Cicero]

On 12/07/2024 at 18:03, Devil-Dick Willie said:

I mean even Liverpool only did it once. You did it twice. You're the jammy git champion of europe. It's in the record books forever.

2012 definitely but we finished 4th in 2021 and City were thoroughly outplayed. Had Werner and Pulisic not been donkey's game could of finished 3-0 before City had their best chance with Mahrez at the dying minutes. 

[Dave]

This loss was hard to take.

Whilst the lack of clear cut chances we created was frustrating, and it's been a problem throughout the entire tournament, I don't think tactically we did anything major wrong against a more inferior team. Holding out until our subs can do damage was a fair strategy but the cross for the winning goal was perfect. 

I think if I was in Gareth's position I would resign. The media have turned and with good reason. We simply should be getting more out of our front four and goals influence the way we play far too much. It cost us against Italy four years ago and it cost us again last night.

I get why the FA wouldn't want to sack him, after Capello there's probably a thought of 'better than devil you know' and Lee Carsley may be ready in 2 to 4 years but I can't see him improving this team now.

[Dr. Gonzo]

6 hours ago, RandoEFC said:

No point playing Alexander-Arnold in this England team. You can be the best crosser in the world but it's useless putting a good ball into the box because Kane will be halfway between the centre circle and the edge of the box jogging vacantly forward rather than getting on the end of anything.

Might have been more useful than Kyle Walker’s shit crossing though.

[Smiley Culture]

2 hours ago, Reluctant Striker said:

You do not think the league's have helped produce & refine a whole bunch of the current squad? Who are starting to look a level above previous generations? I have fully backed Southgate. Until now. Yes, it is the best I've known following England. Where Q-final or semi final respectability was as good as it got

But good luck to you for whatever it is you are actually hoping for & would like to see one day. If your view is genuinely that England is pretty much Sweden, what's the fuss ? you will always have this same lack of comprehension for England football fans & their expectations.

 

The England setup, of which Southgate has played a large part in overseeing, has caused a real change in the England setup and subsequent results. I don’t think any Premier League club gives a flying one about England and why should they?

The Sweden shouts make no sense. The bizarre belief from the ale chucking, Sweet Caroline singing, Sports Direct retro shirt wearing balloon knots that the only way to define success is by winning a trophy is, frankly, lunacy. To suggest the only way Southgate’s tenure will be deemed a success is whether he wins a trophy or not is bizarre. He’s genuinely overhauled the England setup and has instilled a level of commitment that was not seen for decades, with a squad that man for man was not close to the supposed “golden generation”. England pre-Southgate lose to Colombia in 2018, the draw to Tunisia in 2018, they probably draw to the Czechs as well and definitely don’t score an equaliser against Slovakia or win on penalties against the Swiss or come from behind against Holland. I think the England bandwagon has become spoilt, for the most part. England also get an absolute humping if they suddenly decided to go gung-ho against Spain last night too.