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The Royal Family

How do you feel about the monarchy?  

14 members have voted

  1. 1. How do you feel about the monarchy?

    • Fine as it is.
    • Should be kept but needs significant alterations.
    • We should start to look into abolishing it.


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I'll add my own thoughts on this later but after the Prince Andrew scandal and yesterday's resignation of Prince Harry and Meghan Markle as 'senior' members of the royal family, is it time to reassess their place in society?

- Cost issues: Does the money they generate in tourism and interest make up for their lifestyle and their many properties being supported by the state?

- Class issues: Does the existence of the royal family contribute to the class-based divides that some would argue are prevalent in British society?

- Moral issues: This works both ways. Why do we deem members of the royal family to be more important or less susceptible to scrutiny just because of who their parents are? And should Prince Harry (for example) be expected and essentially forced to live the life that he has been asked to live and take all this grief because he's married a black, American actress, just because of who his parents are?

- Political issues: plenty of these, come up with them yourselves.

 

I still don't quite know where I land on this but I wanted to open up the debate. I'll post my thoughts in more detail when I get a chance.

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Do i get to have a say about this as a member of the greater common wealth :ph34r:

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2 hours ago, Azeem said:

Do i get to have a say about this as a member of the greater common wealth :ph34r:

No, isn't that the point :ph34r:

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Outdated, unneeded and complete and utter bullshit 

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It's actually pathetic how much of an issue is being made of this Harry and Meghan resignation thing. It's particularly appalling if the fact that they want to go and live their lives away from the British tabloid press, who must have made the poor girl's life horrible, has caused some sort of rift within the family. They should be nothing but supportive of them. He's sixth in line for the throne ffs. I honestly can't see why it's even deemed debatable that they should be allowed to take a step back and have their own life.

People will say "well they can't complain, they've been living off our tax money their whole lives". I must be one of the only people in the country that doesn't think there's any intrinsic link between happiness and the amount of money or material items somebody owns, as long as you have enough to pay for your basic needs, happiness comes from elsewhere.

If you offered me all of the privilege and wealth and status that came with being a part of the royal family in this country I'd turn you down without a second thought because it just isn't worth it for the compromise I'd have to make on my personal life, my ability to go where I want and do what I want to do without having to think about what's "proper" in terms of my dress, company and actions, and my overall happiness. People think the royal family must be the happiest people in the country because they're rich but actually I think they're more trapped than anyone else, they have almost no freedom as actual people and it's a real sad indictment on the mindset of the country that that lifestyle is even seen as a 'privilege'.

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4 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

It's actually pathetic how much of an issue is being made of this Harry and Meghan resignation thing. It's particularly appalling if the fact that they want to go and live their lives away from the British tabloid press, who must have made the poor girl's life horrible, has caused some sort of rift within the family. They should be nothing but supportive of them. He's sixth in line for the throne ffs. I honestly can't see why it's even deemed debatable that they should be allowed to take a step back and have their own life.

People will say "well they can't complain, they've been living off our tax money their whole lives". I must be one of the only people in the country that doesn't think there's any intrinsic link between happiness and the amount of money or material items somebody owns, as long as you have enough to pay for your basic needs, happiness comes from elsewhere.

If you offered me all of the privilege and wealth and status that came with being a part of the royal family in this country I'd turn you down without a second thought because it just isn't worth it for the compromise I'd have to make on my personal life, my ability to go where I want and do what I want to do without having to think about what's "proper" in terms of my dress, company and actions, and my overall happiness. People think the royal family must be the happiest people in the country because they're rich but actually I think they're more trapped than anyone else, they have almost no freedom as actual people and it's a real sad indictment on the mindset of the country that that lifestyle is even seen as a 'privilege'.

In addition to the first bit there appeared to be little condemnation for Prince Andrew's actions and they seemed to be panicked in to not talking about it at all. But they've gone public with their disappointment with this and all up in arms about a couple that wants to make life better for themselves and get away from what you rightly say i.e. the toxic press always looking to put her down. 

They're adults. They're family. Let them do their own thing ffs. 

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They should absolutely be allowed to do their own thing. It's like being 27 and still living with your parents and having to ask them if you can go out to The Red Lion and your parents saying no because it looks bad on the family.

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The problem for me is that I think they want their cake, and to eat it. It’s almost like they’re going to pick and choose when they’re royals for maximum financial gain. They’ve made a ‘Sussex Royal’ charity and are looking for trademarks. You either want to be a royal or you don’t. 

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Posted (edited)

I'm torn, I've always been a staunch republican, I don't believe in hereditary privilege of any sort and don't believe you can truly call yourself a democracy when you have on family living off the taxes of everyone. I used to passionately want it abolished, but now I'm much more relaxed about it, largely because I've given up on society but something strange has happened. Over the past year or so, the traditionally flag waving, chest thumping right so devoutly royalist have started coming out with the very same arguments that I've been making for years? Why is this? You would normally assume it would be to do with the reprehensible behaviour of the sex offender Andrew, but you would be wrong. What is really getting on the goat of the majority of this festering, tory voting country is that Harry married a black woman. So, as long as they continue to wind up the incorrigibly nasty majority of English people...I'm all for them.

  • Haha 2

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"I want to be a normal multimillionaire!"

Good on him though, rather than be a sponge like the rest of them.

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So long as they remain good looking people who marry cute chicks I'd rather see the world obsess over them than Kardashians and Jenner's.

 

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Serious answer though, I can't understand why you'd get rid of your royal family from weighing up pros and cons. That just seems crazy given how fantastic of a tourism asset they are. There also a rallying symbol and a huge part of the history of your marvelous nation.

I wouldn't be sorry to see the back of all your counts Earls and dukes.... rich cunts who are a million miles away from the throne but are somehow five times richer than the Queen. That sort of old money that simply takes status and entitlement without giving anything in return can fuck off.

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11 minutes ago, Harry said:

Serious answer though, I can't understand why you'd get rid of your royal family from weighing up pros and cons. That just seems crazy given how fantastic of a tourism asset they are. There also a rallying symbol and a huge part of the history of your marvelous nation.

I wouldn't be sorry to see the back of all your counts Earls and dukes.... rich cunts who are a million miles away from the throne but are somehow five times richer than the Queen. That sort of old money that simply takes status and entitlement without giving anything in return can fuck off.

The royal family remain a symbol of pretty much exactly what you describe in your second paragraph. Whichever way you look at it, it's immoral to have a country where someone can spend their entire lives being richer and more 'important' than everyone else just because of who their parents are.

I still think we have a problem in this country where social mobility and meritocracy are overcome by class divides and perception. The royal family is the central symbol of "I'm better than you because my parents were better than your parents and so were their parents before them". In isolation they may bring in more money through tourism than they cost to sustain but there are indirect social and societal impacts to having them around that are harder to measure but should still be considered as well.

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Being richer than everyone else is just a part of society in general though to be honest. One of my best friends (And I love her to death) lives in a £1.5mill house and has never worked a day in her life. It’s just family money. Nobody would be stupid enough to sneer at it. Agreed that it shouldn’t make you more ‘important’, but unfortunately money makes the world go round.

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17 hours ago, DeadLinesman said:

The problem for me is that I think they want their cake, and to eat it. It’s almost like they’re going to pick and choose when they’re royals for maximum financial gain. They’ve made a ‘Sussex Royal’ charity and are looking for trademarks. You either want to be a royal or you don’t. 

This to a degree... I appreciate that people want to go their own way and have no problem with that and as a royal you are almost constantly in the limelight which must be a pain in the arse but on the flipside they do enjoy a very pampered lifestyle that is greatly funded by public money, nanny's for the kids, first class everything, round the clock security wherever they go etc.. I suppose for me I couldn't help thinking that although they wish to step down that they are looking to get out of their royal responsibilities while still enjoying the financial benefits of it all... Both of them knew what being a royal is all about and can't help thinking that this has a lot to do with Meghan who I think has struggled to toe the royal line in a manner that would be expected and Harry comes across as a bit emotionally weak and does not have that stiff upper lip type character about him, they are both a couple of soft puddings really not suited to the demands of the royal lifestyle... 

I do have reservations about how far back they can step in reality as well... They will never ever be seen as anything but royalty from here on in and trying to be Mr & Mrs Smith from 29 Acacia avenue is just not going to cut the mustard for me... They will have every Tesco manager grovelling to push their trolly around for them every time they go and do their weekly shop and will have a huge amount of influence and be able to open a lot of doors for financial gain off the back of who they are.. 

Royalty as a whole? not for not against, although I do have a soft spot for Kate who seems to be able to sparkle and comes across as very genuine and seems to handle the roles and responsibilities of being a royal and a Mum with some ease... 

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35 minutes ago, Harry said:

Serious answer though, I can't understand why you'd get rid of your royal family from weighing up pros and cons. That just seems crazy given how fantastic of a tourism asset they are. There also a rallying symbol and a huge part of the history of your marvelous nation.

I wouldn't be sorry to see the back of all your counts Earls and dukes.... rich cunts who are a million miles away from the throne but are somehow five times richer than the Queen. That sort of old money that simply takes status and entitlement without giving anything in return can fuck off.

They'd be just as good a tourism attraction if they weren't here.

Imagine, we could get loads of macabre, dark tourism for the place where we shot the Queen and her family?

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37 minutes ago, Harry said:

Serious answer though, I can't understand why you'd get rid of your royal family from weighing up pros and cons. That just seems crazy given how fantastic of a tourism asset they are. There also a rallying symbol and a huge part of the history of your marvelous nation.

I wouldn't be sorry to see the back of all your counts Earls and dukes.... rich cunts who are a million miles away from the throne but are somehow five times richer than the Queen. That sort of old money that simply takes status and entitlement without giving anything in return can fuck off.

The French make more in tourism off their royal family and they’re long gone 

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22 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

The royal family remain a symbol of pretty much exactly what you describe in your second paragraph. Whichever way you look at it, it's immoral to have a country where someone can spend their entire lives being richer and more 'important' than everyone else just because of who their parents are.

I still think we have a problem in this country where social mobility and meritocracy are overcome by class divides and perception. The royal family is the central symbol of "I'm better than you because my parents were better than your parents and so were their parents before them". In isolation they may bring in more money through tourism than they cost to sustain but there are indirect social and societal impacts to having them around that are harder to measure but should still be considered as well.

They are also a powerful national symbol though and rather than do nothing, they perform duties for the crown, traveling, soaking, etc, and generally have a positive effect on people everywhere they go, adding excitement and interest to any event or occasion.

The bold, I agree, but we are aggressively and rapidly moving towards a world where wealth is entrenched. It's centred in America which have no royal family. The symbolic gesture of removing the royal family is to me the equivalent of playing the fiddle while Rome burns, and ultimately a situation where considerably more is lost than gained.

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1 minute ago, Harry said:

They are also a powerful national symbol though and rather than do nothing, they perform duties for the crown, traveling, soaking, etc, and generally have a positive effect on people everywhere they go, adding excitement and interest to any event or occasion.

The bold, I agree, but we are aggressively and rapidly moving towards a world where wealth is entrenched. It's centred in America which have no royal family. The symbolic gesture of removing the royal family is to me the equivalent of playing the fiddle while Rome burns, and ultimately a situation where considerably more is lost than gained.

I get what you're saying. We definitely have some sort of subconscious issue where people in this country will trust and believe a white man with a posh accent selling them snake oil over anyone who dares to speak out, not even against the establishment, but with a different opinion to them. The same people dominate our written media and television, government, it's all inter-linked. I hate sounding like some sort of massive hippy talking about the 'establishment' but recent years have shown it to be a very real thing and the royal family is very much a part of it. I don't think for a second that getting rid of them would make any difference in my lifetime but it also doesn't mean I agree with the concept of them. However, given that they're already there and not causing significant or direct harm to anyone while bringing the positives that you mention, I'm still torn on whether I'd get rid of them. I haven't picked an option in the poll yet as a result and I might not at all.

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1 hour ago, Danny said:

The French make more in tourism off their royal family and they’re long gone 

How is that calculation done?

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16 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

How is that calculation done?

Not sure tbh just something I’ve read a few times before but can’t remember 

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I have never been a keen Royalist and never will be, my thoughts are the Royal family and the Queen have more money put together than a lot of small nations so why do we have to pay for keeping the Royal family going? they should be doing their own bit without relying on us to keep them afloat. 

I can remember the Windsor Castle fire in 1992 and they asked for donations for repairs and that kicked up a lot of stinks and because hardly anybody donated the Queen ended up paying millions out of her own coffers for repairs and so she should have and they should have not have asked for donations in the first place, I am one who kicked up a stink about the donation bit.

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https://home.bt.com/news/on-this-day/november-20-1992-queen-faces-huge-repair-bill-as-windsor-castle-is-devastated-by-fire-11363945073106

The wife loves listening to any Royalty gossip than me and loved Princess Diana and she even said when Prince Charles chose her as his future wife "She should not marry that twat, she could do better than him" and the wife was right and the wife said the same about Harry when he chose Meghan as his future wife "Oh no, not her Harry, she is no good for you and just loves herself".

I chose Should be kept but needs significant alterations and I only chose that because of Princess Diana, William & Harry as Princess Diana bought them up in believing that the Royal family should move with the times and stop relying on the British taxpayer to keep them afloat, that's what the wife thinks also.

These are my thoughts only and others may differ. :ay:

 

Edited by CaaC (John)
Spelling corrections

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Adding a bit more good on Harry wanting that, move away from the spotlight and earn his own dosh without relying on mummy & daddy doing it for him, that's his mother's upbringing coming out in him.

We have a grown-up son & daughter who have moved out and don't rely on mummy & daddy anymore but they know that we are here if needed, they make there own dosh with our son as a taxi driver who works all the hours under the sun to bring in the dosh, he doesn't moan about it and when he has a break he will come home with a bottle of wine for mummy & daddy, lagers for himself and we all sit down and have a good chin wag, then our daughter will arrive with the grandsons and then it's happy family time in our little Palace of a 2nd floor flat.  :ay: 

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I actually like both William and Harry, I like Kate Middleton as well. It's the institution that's the problem. Probably that the likes of Philip and Charles who are both of the more pompous, out of touch era, that have been the most senior royals throughout my lifetime. Andrew as well with recent events pretty much contributing 100% to what I think of him. I have a huge amount of respect for the Queen herself.

I think the royals do a bit more than what people make out, probably less in recent years. It's a shame that Harry's going to go off the scene as he was quite involved in a lot of mental health awareness stuff. I think the crown would be viewed a lot more favourably if things fast-forwarded to the part where William was the monarch to be honest.

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3 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

I actually like both William and Harry, I like Kate Middleton as well. It's the institution that's the problem. Probably that the likes of Philip and Charles who are both of the more pompous, out of touch era, that have been the most senior royals throughout my lifetime. Andrew as well with recent events pretty much contributing 100% to what I think of him. I have a huge amount of respect for the Queen herself.

I think the royals do a bit more than what people make out, probably less in recent years. It's a shame that Harry's going to go off the scene as he was quite involved in a lot of mental health awareness stuff. I think the crown would be viewed a lot more favourably if things fast-forwarded to the part where William was the monarch to be honest.

Just imagine you didn't have the queen and the only national leadership you had to look up to and fill you with a sense of pride and purpose was Boris?

Personally as an Aussie even I'm grateful to have the queen..

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I would literally only vote to remove the queen of she started going crazy and posting trump like shit on Twitter.

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1 minute ago, Harry said:

Just imagine you didn't have the queen and the only national leadership you had to look up to and fill you with a sense of pride and purpose was Boris?

Personally as an Aussie even I'm grateful to have the queen..

Honestly, I wouldn't care day to day. I don't have any need to look up to national leadership. They're only people with their positives and flaws like me. The people I look up to are my parents and the people I have worked with that I see as positive role models. And then the occasional sportsperson like Andy Murray or Jenson Button, partially because they represent my country but also because, again, they actually do things worth respecting, and I find them relatable personality-wise.

I have a lot of respect for the Queen like I say but why should I or anyone 'look up to her' just because she's the Queen? She's the Queen because of who her parents were. If she was just some ordinary person and she happened to do great things then I might look up to her. The idea that we should look up to the royal family because...... no reason aside from the fact that they're the royal family is the whole problem with the existence of it.

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