Devil-Dick Willie Posted January 4, 2021 Posted January 4, 2021 1 hour ago, Mpache said: I haven't seen Ings in years, I'm just having a pop for him slating an unpopular opinion I made the other day. And I disagree. If Ings' scores more goals, that makes him a better goalscorer. Higuain was a better goalscorer than Aguero, but he wasn't a better 'striker'. Thats bullshit.
Cicero Posted January 4, 2021 Posted January 4, 2021 Careful. @Berserker will open up his saved folders of Higuains goal to game ratio.
Mpache Posted January 4, 2021 Posted January 4, 2021 2 minutes ago, Devil-Dick Willie said: Thats bullshit. On Higuain being a better goalscorer or Aguero being a better striker?
Devil-Dick Willie Posted January 4, 2021 Posted January 4, 2021 Just now, Mpache said: On Higuain being a better goalscorer or Aguero being a better striker? Higuain being a better goalscorer. The only thing Higuain is better at is eating pies and getting his cock slurped on by berserker.
6666 Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 Hasenhuttl dressing up like Klopp for the game was great mind games.
Mpache Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 2 hours ago, Devil-Dick Willie said: Higuain being a better goalscorer. The only thing Higuain is better at is eating pies and getting his cock slurped on by berserker. After a quick search, Aguero has 20 more career goals than Higuain, so take that as you will. I think in his prime Higuain was a better goalscorer but he lacked longevity. Aguero is a year younger and has done it well for a longer amount of time, so that inflates the stat slightly. Higuain had the Serie A record until last year (and I think it's still joint). Between 2011-2017 (what I consider Higuain and Aguero's prime): Sergio Aguero 2011-12 - 23 goals 2012-13 - 12 goals 2013-14 - 17 goals 2014-15 - 26 goals 2015-16 - 24 goals 2016-17 - 20 goals 122 goals total Gonzalo Higuain 2011-12 - 22 goals 2012-13 - 16 goals 2013-14 - 17 goals 2014-15 - 18 goals 2015-16 - 36 goals 2016-17 - 24 goals 133 goals total However, I also think the consistency needs to be measured. Higuain could have scored a lot of goals in one match and then gone 5 games without scoring before he nets another hattrick. I don't have a lot of sources for that so we'll just look at 2016 and 2017. Aguero was at 0.72 goals per game. Higuain was at 0.93. Both in 2015-16. As for 2016-17, Higuain was at 0.56, Aguero was at 0.76. You might argue to me that you prefer to use your eyes to judge, but stats are the only thing that matter when measuring who is a better 'goalscorer'. Whoever is more consistent and has more goals at their best is the better goalscorer. You can't just say you think one is a better goalscorer than the other without presenting any facts. I provided sufficient context to make it relevant. These stats show it's debatable because they are very close. Have a good day.
Devil-Dick Willie Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Mpache said: After a quick search, Aguero has 20 more career goals than Higuain, so take that as you will. I think in his prime Higuain was a better goalscorer but he lacked longevity. Aguero is a year younger and has done it well for a longer amount of time, so that inflates the stat slightly. Higuain had the Serie A record until last year (and I think it's still joint). Between 2011-2017 (what I consider Higuain and Aguero's prime): Sergio Aguero 2011-12 - 23 goals 2012-13 - 12 goals 2013-14 - 17 goals 2014-15 - 26 goals 2015-16 - 24 goals 2016-17 - 20 goals 122 goals total Gonzalo Higuain 2011-12 - 22 goals 2012-13 - 16 goals 2013-14 - 17 goals 2014-15 - 18 goals 2015-16 - 36 goals 2016-17 - 24 goals 133 goals total However, I also think the consistency needs to be measured. Higuain could have scored a lot of goals in one match and then gone 5 games without scoring before he nets another hattrick. I don't have a lot of sources for that so we'll just look at 2016 and 2017. Aguero was at 0.72 goals per game. Higuain was at 0.93. Both in 2015-16. As for 2016-17, Higuain was at 0.56, Aguero was at 0.76. You might argue to me that you prefer to use your eyes to judge, but stats are the only thing that matter when measuring who is a better 'goalscorer'. Whoever is more consistent and has more goals at their best is the better goalscorer. You can't just say you think one is a better goalscorer than the other without presenting any facts. I provided sufficient context to make it relevant. These stats show it's debatable because they are very close. Have a good day. Higuain scored goals for a Real team with a god tier attack against farmers in a string of 8-0 victories (overshaddowed by the stars, Benzema, Ronnie and Di Maria) and then in the retirement league Aguero scored EPL goals for a decade, generally had the best goals to minutes ratio even when he wasn't top scorer as @Happy Blue will tell you. Have a good day.
Subscriber Mel81x+ Posted January 5, 2021 Subscriber Posted January 5, 2021 Have teams figured us out a bit? I'd like to say yes and the X-Factor for Klopp was Diogo. Teams thought they could play this block system and get away with it but then we went and got Diogo who slips up and down the midfield causing teams to have to play differently. Now, with him gone and the fact that our natural midfielders are playing defensive positions its become a bit easier for teams to sit back and absorb pressure with the chance to counter. I still think we wont drop too far from the top and this patch will end but I also think we're not going to do it without having Thiago and Diogo back till the end of the season if possible.
Mpache Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Devil-Dick Willie said: Higuain scored goals for a Real team with a god tier attack against farmers in a string of 8-0 victories (overshaddowed by the stars, Benzema, Ronnie and Di Maria) and then in the retirement league Aguero scored EPL goals for a decade, generally had the best goals to minutes ratio even when he wasn't top scorer as @Happy Blue will tell you. Have a good day. So Agüero is a better scorer because you say so. Right. I literally posted perfectly relevant statistics and you deny it due to your personal agenda. I even left it at “it’s debatable” due to how close the 2 were at and claimed Agüero had more longevity, which it is. Also this isn’t a discussion of how good he actually was, just who was a better scorer. So I don’t know what him being overshadowed at Real Madrid has anything to do with this. Inzaghi and Palermo were shit but both were great at scoring goals.
Administrator Stan Posted January 5, 2021 Author Administrator Posted January 5, 2021 5 hours ago, Mpache said: After a quick search, Aguero has 20 more career goals than Higuain, so take that as you will. I think in his prime Higuain was a better goalscorer but he lacked longevity. Aguero is a year younger and has done it well for a longer amount of time, so that inflates the stat slightly. Higuain had the Serie A record until last year (and I think it's still joint). Between 2011-2017 (what I consider Higuain and Aguero's prime): Sergio Aguero 2011-12 - 23 goals 2012-13 - 12 goals 2013-14 - 17 goals 2014-15 - 26 goals 2015-16 - 24 goals 2016-17 - 20 goals 122 goals total Gonzalo Higuain 2011-12 - 22 goals 2012-13 - 16 goals 2013-14 - 17 goals 2014-15 - 18 goals 2015-16 - 36 goals 2016-17 - 24 goals 133 goals total However, I also think the consistency needs to be measured. Higuain could have scored a lot of goals in one match and then gone 5 games without scoring before he nets another hattrick. I don't have a lot of sources for that so we'll just look at 2016 and 2017. Aguero was at 0.72 goals per game. Higuain was at 0.93. Both in 2015-16. As for 2016-17, Higuain was at 0.56, Aguero was at 0.76. You might argue to me that you prefer to use your eyes to judge, but stats are the only thing that matter when measuring who is a better 'goalscorer'. Whoever is more consistent and has more goals at their best is the better goalscorer. You can't just say you think one is a better goalscorer than the other without presenting any facts. I provided sufficient context to make it relevant. These stats show it's debatable because they are very close. Have a good day. This is absolute bollocks and you know it.
Mpache Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 Just now, Stan said: This is absolute bollocks and you know it. For best goalscorer? It's not at all. For measuring a player's abilities you should use your own judgement and then have evidence to back it up, but just scoring goals you need to have numerical proof to be able to say you're a "better goalscorer". You can judge who is a better finisher on your own without the use of stats. Even with xG around I can debate that finishing can be read well without it, but when it comes to just goals scored you need numerical proof. What are Inzaghi and Palermo then? The point isn't who is a good player or even finisher, just who is able to get it in the back of the net most often.
Administrator Stan Posted January 5, 2021 Author Administrator Posted January 5, 2021 For someone who bangs on about players in South America and who has said before that you've watched them regularly there either at club or international level so would know best, this certainly comes as a surprise to realise only stats are needed to see who is a better goalscorer. It smacks of now saying 'stats are good' purely to suit your point that you think Higuain is a better goalscorer in your opinion.
Mpache Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 1 hour ago, Stan said: For someone who bangs on about players in South America and who has said before that you've watched them regularly there either at club or international level so would know best, this certainly comes as a surprise to realise only stats are needed to see who is a better goalscorer. It smacks of now saying 'stats are good' purely to suit your point that you think Higuain is a better goalscorer in your opinion. You're right, I've said many many times in the past stats are meaningless. Things change, if you look at my Twitter actually everytime I make a point I try to present it in facts. It's something I would have never done until 2019, because I simply didn't believe in them. However, I don't see how you can measure goalscorers without number of goals. A goalscorer scores goals, and the tallies are measured in numbers. Saying something like "Higuain scores everytime I see him play" is generalizing. A "striker" is something else, and requires much more than just the simple effort of getting it in the back of the net. Midfielders can be good goalscorers too.
Administrator Stan Posted January 5, 2021 Author Administrator Posted January 5, 2021 5 minutes ago, Mpache said: However, I don't see how you can measure goalscorers without number of goals. A goalscorer scores goals, and the tallies are measured in numbers. Saying something like "Higuain scores everytime I see him play" is generalizing. A "striker" is something else, and requires much more than just the simple effort of getting it in the back of the net. I'm not saying that. I'm not saying you don't measure number of goals to judge who's the better goalscorer. I'm saying stats are not the only thing to measure it by, and not just the best thing to do it by either. If you want to keep it as basic as that then so be it.
LFCMike Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 I think some of ours do need to chill out a bit. No team has followed two 90+point seasons with another. Chelsea 83 in 06/07 and City 81 last season. A total around that has you in the title race this season. Of course we'll need to start putting a winning run together at some point. Other sides have had bad patches already this season then put three or four wins together and they're right back up there. Liverpool are already up there
Rick Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 2 hours ago, LFCMike said: I think some of ours do need to chill out a bit. No team has followed two 90+point seasons with another. Chelsea 83 in 06/07 and City 81 last season. A total around that has you in the title race this season. Of course we'll need to start putting a winning run together at some point. Other sides have had bad patches already this season then put three or four wins together and they're right back up there. Liverpool are already up there It’s true, despite us not picking up the points we should have done, we still see ourselves in first. But, how shit or inconsistent other other teams have been should have no bearing on how we judge ourselves. We are still first because everybody has been crap this last fortnight, not on merit for why we’ve don in that same space of time. You can’t tell me that 6 point from the last five games, against those teams we have played, is anything short of dogshit. We have stopped 9 points from the last 15 and that could have been a perfect cushion to go into the next month with. Giving other teams like Utd & City motivation by playing so shite against the likes of Fulham & West Brom is worrying. Add to that, we are taking two of our best midfielders out of the midfield to plug the defence and who knows how long we will have to do that? Matip out for another fortnight, and when he does come back it’s just a matter of time before he’s out again. Signing players for the back is essential if we want to retain this title, we have just about got this far with what we have had to work with but with Utd pushing and City starting to gear up, we won’t get away with it for too much longer. These last five games have been very concerning in my opinion, the team have looked absolutely knackered and easy to defend against, and the lack of proper investment at the back in the last couple of years is biting us in the arse. Klopp needs to figure this one out before next Sunday because we really need to beat Man Utd.
Danny Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, Rick said: It’s true, despite us not picking up the points we should have done, we still see ourselves in first. But, how shit or inconsistent other other teams have been should have no bearing on how we judge ourselves. We are still first because everybody has been crap this last fortnight, not on merit for why we’ve don in that same space of time. You literally are first based on merit
Rick Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 10 minutes ago, Danny said: You literally are first based on merit Haha I’ve not worded that too well. I mean that we are still first because despite us dropping lots of the points in the last few games, the likes of Spurs & Chelsea have dropped more which has helped us stay up there rather than what we have done ourselves in the same space of time.
LFCMike Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 5 minutes ago, Rick said: It’s true, despite us not picking up the points we should have done, we still see ourselves in first. But, how shit or inconsistent other other teams have been should have no bearing on how we judge ourselves. We are still first because everybody has been crap this last fortnight, not on merit for why we’ve don in that same space of time. You can’t tell me that 6 point from the last five games, against those teams we have played, is anything short of dogshit. We have stopped 9 points from the last 15 and that could have been a perfect cushion to go into the next month with. Giving other teams like Utd & City motivation by playing so shite against the likes of Fulham & West Brom is worrying. Add to that, we are taking two of our best midfielders out of the midfield to plug the defence and who knows how long we will have to do that? Matip out for another fortnight, and when he does come back it’s just a matter of time before he’s out again. Signing players for the back is essential if we want to retain this title, we have just about got this far with what we have had to work with but with Utd pushing and City starting to gear up, we won’t get away with it for too much longer. These last five games have been very concerning in my opinion, the team have looked absolutely knackered and easy to defend against, and the lack of proper investment at the back in the last couple of years is biting us in the arse. Klopp needs to figure this one out before next Sunday because we really need to beat Man Utd. I'm not saying that some of the performances or results have been acceptable, they haven't. I think this is more what a normal season looks like though. A bad patch for this side over the previous two seasons has been back to back draws. Winning 26 out of your first 27 games is not normal and people need to stop judging against that. It'll be a much closer title race this year. I think that's the reason people are so outraged when Liverpool drop points. You have become used to seeing Liverpool streets ahead of everyone or everyone bar Man City. Having a blip for a game, maybe two then bouncing back. That was never going to happen every season. God forbidb if they have a bad patch that has lasted 3 games. You can either embrace the closer title race or carry on crying on the internet when Liverpool drop points. When they're top of the league, I'll say it again. Looks like Klopp needs a bit of time on the training ground with them I think. He should get that now given the team I suspect he will play at Aston Villa on Friday and then we don't play until Sunday
Subscriber RandoEFC+ Posted January 5, 2021 Subscriber Posted January 5, 2021 Said it all along, Liverpool should have built a better scouting network in Ecuador, they'd have three centre backs ready to step in for Van Dijk if they had and they'd all be under 23 too.
Danny Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said: Discuss..... Why would you chuck that grenade out there?
DeadLinesman Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 2 minutes ago, Danny said: Why would you chuck that grenade out there?
Dr. Gonzo Posted January 5, 2021 Posted January 5, 2021 21 minutes ago, DeadLinesman said: Discuss..... Neither of them are really #9s (yeah yeah, I know it's what's on the back of Firmino's shirt, but Milner's also our #7... and traditionally that's been for players like King Kenny and Suarez so... I wouldn't read too much into that) & Adrian Durham probably knows this but knows this will be a "hot take" to "generate discussion" (i.e., comments from insane people on the talksport.com page) and get talksport lots of clicks, which gets them more money from advertisers. And that is how Adrian Durham earns his Christmas bonuses each year boys and girls
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.