Harry Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 4 minutes ago, Pep Talk said: wasting money on Keita yet the defence is shocking. Should of sold Coutinho and spend that money on VVD and a few other defenders It wasnt a case of one or the other. The problem was we didn't get the vvd deal done despite having the money to do so. And we clearly decided not to go elsewhere and still to let sakho go. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pep Talk Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 1 minute ago, Harry said: It wasnt a case of one or the other. The problem was we didn't get the vvd deal done despite having the money to do so. And we clearly decided not to go elsewhere and still to let sakho go. suppose there is still hope in jan for VVD? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber RandoEFC+ Posted October 22, 2017 Subscriber Share Posted October 22, 2017 That list of transfers doesn't actually look bad at all. Mane, Wijnaldum, Salah the only ones with significant fees and they've all been successful, Chamberlain probably won't justify his fee but too early to say. It's not the money spent that's a concern for Klopp, it's the lack of money spent on improving the same key positions on the pitch that have been an issue since he took over. Long way to go before we can compare him to Wenger who has ignored Arsenal's defensive midfield problem since Vieira left in about 2005, though I do see what people are saying about the similarities not addressing key areas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 2 minutes ago, Pep Talk said: suppose there is still hope in jan for VVD? I guess that's the hope. But really we need two anyway so we still shouldn't be limping through to jan the way we are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Administrator Stan Posted October 22, 2017 Author Administrator Share Posted October 22, 2017 i think you need more than just Van Dijk to save you. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Inverted Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 I can almost understand his stubbornness since defense is the part of the team that is least reliant on individual quality: familiarity and structure are just as important as how individually good your defenders are so maybe he was hoping time would improve things - and unless they got their absolute ideal in VVD, it wouldn't be worth the disruption. But Lovren is still capable of almost single-handedly losing matches, and it doesn't look that anything can change that. I think Klopp might have come to that realisation today. And defensively I think having a real controlling midfielder instead of Henderson would be a massive boost. Even if you have a player who isn't a brilliant defender in that role, if you have someone intelligent and more technically assured in Henderson's place, you move the ball better, you don't give it away so easily, and you react better to losing the ball. All of those things add up to take a massive load off the defense even if none of them are immediately apparently defensive. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Dave Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 From the little ive seen of Keita he looks like a through ball guru. With the attacking four Liverpool have it's the perfect fit. The defence however is a cluster fuck of a conversation that I'm not prepared to have. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Artful Dodger Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 Does Klopp just not want to defend? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Harry Posted October 22, 2017 Share Posted October 22, 2017 15 minutes ago, Aaroncpfc said: From the little ive seen of Keita he looks like a through ball guru. With the attacking four Liverpool have it's the perfect fit. The defence however is a cluster fuck of a conversation that I'm not prepared to have. Keita will probably need to replace Coutinho in our first 11 in terms of through ball output. 5 minutes ago, The Artful Dodger said: Does Klopp just not want to defend? Attack is the best form of defence. 37 minutes ago, Inverted said: I can almost understand his stubbornness since defense is the part of the team that is least reliant on individual quality: familiarity and structure are just as important as how individually good your defenders are so maybe he was hoping time would improve things - and unless they got their absolute ideal in VVD, it wouldn't be worth the disruption. But Lovren is still capable of almost single-handedly losing matches, and it doesn't look that anything can change that. I think Klopp might have come to that realisation today. And defensively I think having a real controlling midfielder instead of Henderson would be a massive boost. Even if you have a player who isn't a brilliant defender in that role, if you have someone intelligent and more technically assured in Henderson's place, you move the ball better, you don't give it away so easily, and you react better to losing the ball. All of those things add up to take a massive load off the defense even if none of them are immediately apparently defensive. Familiarity and structure is largely the problem that causes us so much trouble from set pieces. Players know that Migs will flap. Everybody loses their heads. A goal is ultimately scored. I feel that confidence in the GK is one of the biggest issues we have and its been prevalent since BR replaced Reina. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Dan+ Posted October 23, 2017 Subscriber Share Posted October 23, 2017 5 hours ago, FOYM said: He is. Was gutted when I saw him starting. But it was either him or Ox, who is shitter. Can't believe 40m was spent on him. Oxlade-Chamberlain is one of the most baffling signings I have ever seen. A massive amount of money for a player the jury's still out on in a position you didn't really need, who doesn't even start when you're missing players in his position, when you have other areas that need improving. A totally bemusing signing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pep Talk Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 weird thing is he turned down chelsea for liverpool. Surely he would be more likely to play at chelsea now than he is at liverpool given their depth and issues. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Blue Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 4 hours ago, VanPaddy said: It probably wont Happen, Klopp is turning into Wenger or already is similar, this thing about playing a certain style and not changing his ways, it just doesn't get you anywhere without a strong spine through the team. Pep has said he will never change his style too, he would never park the bus to get a result as winning in that matter is against everything he stands for ..we would rather lose trying to play good football than win ugly like Mourhino Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Subscriber Mel81x+ Posted October 23, 2017 Subscriber Share Posted October 23, 2017 Think the first 20 minutes showed the rest of the league how to get at Liverpool and the defensive errors had always been there for teams to exploit if they were given the chance. Don't think this changes anything for Klopp either because his options are limited and hes going to have to make do with what he has till an opportunity arises to rectify the defensive issues which have been glaring for a long time now. I can't see this team doing much to break into the top four because the difference between this year and last year was that when it came to games against the top 4 contenders you could say that we were going to win but now it seems like a struggle. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Danny Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 I can't believe there are no other alternatives out there to VVD, Liverpools defence just isn't strong enough and they'll struggle to qualify for a Champions League position at this rate. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chaaay AFC Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 6 hours ago, Pep Talk said: weird thing is he turned down chelsea for liverpool. Surely he would be more likely to play at chelsea now than he is at liverpool given their depth and issues. He went to Liverpool because he believes he is a central midfielder and he felt he would get more game time there for Liverpool. Although I'm sure Klopp came out recently and said his best position is on the wing. He is a pretty average winger though and he will never play consistently if Salah and Mane stay fit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Happy Blue Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 4 hours ago, Teso dos Bichos said: Guess he didnt learn his lesson after mourinho embarrassed and outclassed his Barcelona(THE BEST TEAM OF ALL-TIME) team (inter vs Barcelona) Mourinho couldn't embarrass Pep even if he was covered in diarrhea as Mourinho's style of football is still more embarrassing ...spends 200million and plays negative Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HK85 Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 4 hours ago, Teso dos Bichos said: Guess he didnt learn his lesson after mourinho embarrassed and outclassed his Barcelona(THE BEST TEAM OF ALL-TIME) team (inter vs Barcelona) He definitely didn't learn his lesson. I mean forget that a few months after this Barca won Jose's Madrid 5-0 and just a year later, when they met in another Champions League semi final, Madrid were beaten again. I think Mourinho got sent off and was crying about a conspiracy as well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Carnivore Chris Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 5 hours ago, Teso dos Bichos said: Guess he didnt learn his lesson after mourinho embarrassed and outclassed his Barcelona(THE BEST TEAM OF ALL-TIME) team (inter vs Barcelona) That never happened. The only time he beat Pep while at Real Madrid was by a single goal after making games as scrappy as you will ever see a clasico, he never outclassed or embarrassed the opposition even slightly. All he did was make Clasicos dull and tedious, something they never were previous to his arrival or since his departure. The only hammering was this:- It's the only Clasico he set out his team to play football in and look what happened. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 20 minutes ago, The Rebel CRS said: All he did was make Clasicos dull and tedious Wars mate! He made them into wars... He has such a chaotic part to his character that this is exactly what begins to happen when he can't find the key... Make it rain chaos! Even when he wins in circumstances like these, he then feeds petrol to the fire. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Panna King Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 2 hours ago, Chaaay AFC said: He went to Liverpool because he believes he is a central midfielder and he felt he would get more game time there for Liverpool. Although I'm sure Klopp came out recently and said his best position is on the wing. He is a pretty average winger though and he will never play consistently if Salah and Mane stay fit. Its Obvious very soon that the OX will be played at right back. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Burning Gold Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 Haven't read back through the thread so not sure if this has been mentioned, but Lovren shouldn't even be playing. Not because he's shit (which he is) but because he's not fit. He barely trains and he needs something like five injections just to make it through a match. Even without that knowledge, every football fan in the world knew we needed at least one centre back in the summer because we're short on both depth and quality. Forget van Dijk; he's a distraction. It should've been blindingly obvious that we weren't going to get him from the moment we were made to release that statement. We should have moved on to other targets. What did we do instead? Waited all summer for Southampton to invite us to bid for a player they didn't want to sell. Fucks sake. I'm not ready to jump onto the 'Klopp out' bandwagon just yet, but heads need to roll for the disastrous summer we've had. 12 hours ago, RandoEFC said: It's not the money spent that's a concern for Klopp, it's the lack of money spent on improving the same key positions on the pitch that have been an issue since he took over. It's been that way with Liverpool for years. Always spending money, never addressing the actual problems in the squad. Last summer we needed a left back. We were stuck with Milner there all season (he did alright, to be fair). Before that, we needed a right back for years because Johnson was shite, but it took us (off the top of my head) 5 years to replace him. This'll be Mignolet's fifth season at the club and he hasn't been good enough from day one. We even had that one summer in 2012 when we so desperately needed a striker, and so desperately failed to sign one, that the owners released a pre-written statement apologising as soon as the window shut. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 I'll await the day Mourinho embarrassed Pep. The Bernabeu is now a 2nd home for Barca because of Mourinho Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 Love how Teso keeps bringing up this Inter vs Barca match yet completely ignores a year later Barca taking the mickey out of Mourinho's Real Madrid in the CL Inter beat Barca because Inter had players that respected Mou. Barca beat Real Madrid because Real didn't have players that respected Mou. Belitters Barca for only winning the Copa Del Rey last year, yet uses it as a strengthening point for Mourinho's first season at Real Madrid. The fallacy of 'self serving bias' should have Teso's picture on it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SirBalon Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Cicero Posted October 23, 2017 Share Posted October 23, 2017 29 minutes ago, Teso dos Bichos said: self-serving bias??? n....ga please You are the pinnacle of it. If you were to hit the crossbar your first try, you'd blame it on your own personal skill. If you'd fail to hit it, you'd blame the pitch or say the wind threw you off. Don't even deny it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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