Monday 20th August - Crystal Palace 0-2 Liverpool

[UNORTHODOX]

Job done from us tonight, It wasn't as comfortable as it could have been in the end because Palace had a few chances even after they went down to 10 men. Both of the decisions were correct in my eyes, dont see what the controversy is about at all 

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Love how rattled all the Reds are over these diving accusations. Struck a nerve much .

I'm only annoyed by this whole "oh he does this all the time" or "typical different rules for Liverpool" shite - last season we had so many players fouled in the box... and only 2 fucking penalties. I do like the fear though.

[The Liquidator]

20 minutes ago, UNORTHODOX said:

Well Salah got the decision and it led to Liverpool winning the game so at least he improves us.

Ahhhh Unorthodox..... I am still rattling around in your mind I see

Enjoy the season feller, this might just be the best chance your guys have of winning something!

By the way, now seen it & I think it was a penalty

[Storts]

 

[Dr. Gonzo]

Complete sidenote to the result or anything... but didn't it seem like every player on the pitch, on both sides, was very fucking quick? Salah, Mane, Keita, Van Aanholt, Scluup, Zaha, Townsend are all very fast and then everyone else might not be like blindingly quick, but nobody on the pitch was slow at all.

[LFCMike]

Alisson's distribution is superb. Van Dijk won pretty much everything. The whole back four seem much more assured under pressure. There were times when they put us under pressure from set pieces where we'd have probably crumbled in recent years. Palace made us work for the win but the air of confidence that Van Dijk and Alisson bring improves us no end

[Happy Blue]

Liverpool looking good, might be worth having a few quid on them for the title 

[Bluewolf]

1 hour ago, LFCMike said:

I don't see how he's done that for the red card incident. He's clearly fouled. Whether it should have been a red because he's lost control of the ball is another matter.

I am not disputing the foul or the red card... It's the dramatics I would like to see less of from players.. and that's all round, not just Salah or just Liverpool but all of them.. 

It's not just a Salah thing mate it's a football disease for a great many players... The rolling, The crying out loud in pain, the rubbing or holding of the claimed injured part of the body.. add in to that the stumbling/falling, the arm flailing and then the claims for a penalty or free kick straight after going down and it just becomes boring to watch... A lot of these players only need to be touched even slightly and they are going down. Any decent player would be battling to stay on their feet if they could only being pole axed by a serious clout... A lot of these players that are seemingly down and out for the count are soon jumping back to their feet in seconds as right as rain as soon as the ref waves play on.. they are normally fit enough to chase him round the pitch while putting in their claim for the injustice... 

All teams have them and sometimes you get the calls sometimes you don't but it's the way they implement the rules on foul play that allow for it to be exploited.... Another aspect that is always disappointing is this retrospective punishment.. The situation with Kenedy being a point in case, Clear act of violence that was deemed dealt with as the ref awarded a free kick even though the ref was unaware of what happened right next to him... but lets not punish that behavior even though he was caught bang to rights... How can we expect players to behave any differently if everything that's there to ensure fair play is ignored both on the pitch and off it?? 

Don't let my rant take away from the game though... The one that mattered was the pen and it was a pen so no complaints about that.. It was a very entertaining game with both sides putting in decent displays.. Palace should do ok this season watching them tonight and Liverpool showing they can get a result without necessarily being in top form..  

[LFCMadLad]

Jurgen on the last few minutes: "In these moments the fuel is really low and maybe the players need a bit of help from an angry manager - 'run or I will kill you' - and they did that with a fantastic counter attack."

[Dan+]

Far bigger win that they will probably get credit for. Palace away is one of the biggest banana skin fixtures in the league and Liverpool have come away from it with three points and another clean sheet. Perfect night.

[RandoEFC+]

Sad that my attempt to pour fuel on the fire didn't get much of a reaction but I'll be back with an improved effort at the next opportunity.

Some serious points to add to the game. Both "contentious" decisions that went Liverpool's way tonight were the correct decisions. I was going to add earlier but @Inverted got in there first, that you can't exactly expect Salah not to go down because even though he was fouled the referee won't give it if he tries to stay on his feet. People complain about diving but so often when you see players get fouled but not go down, they don't get the foul. This is a chicken or egg argument for me now. Is it the referee at fault for assuming that it can only be a foul if someone hits the floor? Or do we blame the players for allowing dramatic diving and rolling around to become an intrinsic part of football which has led to referees being conditioned this way? I don't know but I do think that even if you're a real honest player nowadays and you get twatted by someone but try to carry on it's playing on your mind that you should have gone down because apparently now the victim staying on their feet signals to the referee that they weren't fouled.

Anyway, the red card was fair too. You could argue that Salah may have lost control of the ball before the contact so it should only be a yellow but it's clutching at straws. Shame for Wan Bissaka who played well and his performance didn't deserve that ending but it was the right call for me.

Neville and Carragher as well as some of the Twitterati have taken a lot of time this evening to praise Van Dijk. I'm sure he's been very good for Liverpool and he had a decent game tonight but it seems an odd time to give him the extra attention as if this was a stand out performance. Benteke must be one of the worst starting strikers in the Premier League or Championship right now, and I don't think that's even that much of an exaggeration. Incredibly, Palace have managed to find an even less effective centre forward to sit on the bench in Sorloth. The lack of a half decent striker to help Zaha is probably the main weakness for me in an otherwise very solid side. Going back to VVD though, I'm sure he may deserve those plaudits for his performances since January for Liverpool but just found it strange they chose tonight to spend time on him when I'd hardly describe his opposition as one that leaves him with his work cut out.

They interviewed Van Dijk after the game and I have to say Sky get more pathetic with every passing day. I rate Carragher and Neville as probably their best pundits but for fucks sake they were one step short of begging Van Dijk to fall into the trap of talking about a title challenge. It's utterly transparent and pathetic the lengths they go to constantly to form narratives themselves so they can either say they called it at the start of the season or shoot it down in flames with comments like "It's hard to believe people were talking about a Liverpool title challenge just a few months ago" if things don't go well and they're 4th at Christmas or something. I don't even watch much or any Liverpool coverage beyond the live games but this evening's post match has to be about the 7th time I've heard Klopp had to talk down the title talk because Sky keep asking him the same questions in every interview in the hope that they get one comment that they can spin either further hysteria about a Liverpool title challenge or pluck out of the archive in a few months if they're not up there.

Pathetic bastards. It's not this either. They've made pointless things like Spurs Wembley curse last season, the Kane August thing, laying the groundwork for the Mourinho meltdown way ahead of schedule because they're dying for it to happen. Absolutely dreadful coverage which becomes more and more of a soap opera every week.

[Dr. Gonzo]

3 minutes ago, RandoEFC said:

Sad that my attempt to pour fuel on the fire didn't get much of a reaction but I'll be back with an improved effort at the next opportunity.

Some serious points to add to the game. Both "contentious" decisions that went Liverpool's way tonight were the correct decisions. I was going to add earlier but @Inverted got in there first, that you can't exactly expect Salah not to go down because even though he was fouled the referee won't give it if he tries to stay on his feet. People complain about diving but so often when you see players get fouled but not go down, they don't get the foul. This is a chicken or egg argument for me now. Is it the referee at fault for assuming that it can only be a foul if someone hits the floor? Or do we blame the players for allowing dramatic diving and rolling around to become an intrinsic part of football which has led to referees being conditioned this way? I don't know but I do think that even if you're a real honest player nowadays and you get twatted by someone but try to carry on it's playing on your mind that you should have gone down because apparently now the victim staying on their feet signals to the referee that they weren't fouled.

Anyway, the red card was fair too. You could argue that Salah may have lost control of the ball before the contact so it should only be a yellow but it's clutching at straws. Shame for Wan Bissaka who played well and his performance didn't deserve that ending but it was the right call for me.

Neville and Carragher as well as some of the Twitterati have taken a lot of time this evening to praise Van Dijk. I'm sure he's been very good for Liverpool and he had a decent game tonight but it seems an odd time to give him the extra attention as if this was a stand out performance. Benteke must be one of the worst starting strikers in the Premier League or Championship right now, and I don't think that's even that much of an exaggeration. Incredibly, Palace have managed to find an even less effective centre forward to sit on the bench in Sorloth. The lack of a half decent striker to help Zaha is probably the main weakness for me in an otherwise very solid side. Going back to VVD though, I'm sure he may deserve those plaudits for his performances since January for Liverpool but just found it strange they chose tonight to spend time on him when I'd hardly describe his opposition as one that leaves him with his work cut out.

They interviewed Van Dijk after the game and I have to say Sky get more pathetic with every passing day. I rate Carragher and Neville as probably their best pundits but for fucks sake they were one step short of begging Van Dijk to fall into the trap of talking about a title challenge. It's utterly transparent and pathetic the lengths they go to constantly to form narratives themselves so they can either say they called it at the start of the season or shoot it down in flames with comments like "It's hard to believe people were talking about a Liverpool title challenge just a few months ago" if things don't go well and they're 4th at Christmas or something. I don't even watch much or any Liverpool coverage beyond the live games but this evening's post match has to be about the 7th time I've heard Klopp had to talk down the title talk because Sky keep asking him the same questions in every interview in the hope that they get one comment that they can spin either further hysteria about a Liverpool title challenge or pluck out of the archive in a few months if they're not up there.

Pathetic bastards. It's not this either. They've made pointless things like Spurs Wembley curse last season, the Kane August thing, laying the groundwork for the Mourinho meltdown way ahead of schedule because they're dying for it to happen. Absolutely dreadful coverage which becomes more and more of a soap opera every week.

That Sky stuff is because they need to manufacture the whole "pantomime" nature of the EPL, the media narratives they sell to fans are what keep the drama going. Some people don't find the football to be entertainment enough, and they need the bullshit pantomime drama to keep them going. That's the only way I can explain it, other than media narratives work - they get people interested and they get viewers tuned in to watch the "drama."

Personally, I think there's enough drama in the league with 6 very good clubs at the top and shitloads of money making other clubs look up at those 6 clubs and think "I bet we can use our money to give them a run for their money."

As for the Van Djik praise... I get what you're saying, to an extent, shutting down Benteke really doesn't seem that hard. It probably should seem harder with all of his physical attributes and what his strengths are... but his weaknesses of: poor first (and second, third, fourth, fifth... etc.) touch, shite finishing, lack of movement/lack of useful attacking movement, inability to pick out teammates etc... don't make him as formidable of a striker as it seemed he would be when he was banging them in at Villa for fun. But statistically, Van Djik was very impressive - and both he and Alisson were probably the two best players on the winning side. If you look at his stats, it's easier to praise him than it is to praise the keeper: 100% tackles won, 92.4% passing accuracy, 91 touches, 10 successful long balls, 9 aerial duels won. Pretty much everything you could ask from your CB.

When you match his performance with the fact that it's Palace, a side that recently (although not that recently) has been a thorn in our side... and that these matches where the front 3 has not been as potent and we've struggled to get something from a match against a good side playing deep and well organised… I can understand why the media narrative is focusing on VVD, to an extent. He's an individual who's come in and made a difference in the sort of matches that typically our defense is our own worst enemy and basically not put a foot wrong.

Personally, I think it was a good team performance - but if I had to single out 2 players for how well they played, I'd go with Alisson & VVD.

[Burning Gold]

It wasn't a performance for the archives from van Dijk tonight, but this was exactly the sort of game where we'd have ended up dropping points in the last few years and he's a massive part of why we look more solid these days. These aren't the games where his quality and value really shines through, but they're probably the ones in which he adds most to the team.

I'd understand if that was why Sky chose to focus on him, but it isn't really. No one really stood out tonight, and ultimately they had to talk about someone 

[LFCMadLad]

Virgil van Dijk’s game by numbers vs. Crystal Palace:

100% tackles won
92.4% pass accuracy
91 touches
10 successful long balls
9 aerial duels won
8 clearances
2 tackles
1 clean sheet

Dominant display. MOTM.

[Stan]

1 hour ago, LFCMadLad said:

Virgil van Dijk’s game by numbers vs. Crystal Palace:

100% tackles won
92.4% pass accuracy
91 touches
10 successful long balls
9 aerial duels won
8 clearances
2 tackles
1 clean sheet

Dominant display. MOTM.

then factor in some of those stats were against Christian Benteke  

In all honesty, you can only do your best against what's in front of you and I do agree he had a dominant game. The whole of your defence did to be fair. Wan-Bissaka will get credit deservedly so, but I thought Robertson was just as good for Liverpool going forward as you'd expect.

[Harry]

15 hours ago, RandoEFC said:

It's a foul. It's also a dive. Penalty the right call for me even if it's soft. More because other penalties have been given for the same thing than because penalties should be given for that but that's the state of the sport now.

I'd say no penalty. That's the kind of foul that I'd expect to get away with as a defender. 

[Harry]

15 hours ago, Stan said:

Good decision by Oliver, that. Obviously going at speed and with the way the ball went from his angle, some might have been mistaken that he got a touch on the ball. Don't think refs get enough credit when the game is played so quickly with players like Wan-Bissaka and Salah at full pelt.

 my first reaction was its not a red card. 

[Harry]

15 hours ago, The Palace Fan said:

We need to bring foreign refs over. The standard has become an absolute joke.

That's going a bit far. There was enough in both of those events for those calls to be made and be defensible...

Still for me harsh decisions but both the kind of situations that if they happen 100 times will be split 60-40...

There's some bad luck in that but also a need to avoid those situations occurring in the first place and/or being more clean in the tackles...

[Harry]

15 hours ago, Bluewolf said:

Palace have done really well tonight to keep Liverpool down to one penalty.... defended well and can consider themselves unlucky not to have been on the score sheet themselves.. 

It's games like this where Liverpool have in the past dropped points or even gone on to lose the game so with them not playing at their best tonight they still had a enough to carve out the result...

Agreed. No way we'd have kept a clean sheet last season. Palace were solid. 

For me they should be top half comfortably this season...

[Harry]

2 hours ago, Stan said:

then factor in some of those stats were against Christian Benteke  

In all honesty, you can only do your best against what's in front of you and I do agree he had a dominant game. The whole of your defence did to be fair. Wan-Bissaka will get credit deservedly so, but I thought Robertson was just as good for Liverpool going forward as you'd expect.

It wasn't an impressive attacking performance from us.  and was the type of game we'd concede in last year imo. So to me unsurprising that people would focus on VVD and Alisson as the new additions that have brought improved defensive reliability... keita though was also good value. So tidy on the ball and always seems to look like he has time and space even when he has no right to....

He's looking like i player I'll really enjoy watching in the year ahead. 

[SchalkeUK]

Very surprised at Roy.  Palace's game needed a kick up the middle and he waited until 80 minutes to bring on young Max.  Even then one of the best dead ball young players in Europe was ignored with a free kick in a dangerous area and a corner to follow and not used. Perhaps his knowledge of his new man's abilities has not been transmitted to him.  Overall not a disaster, but poor decisions from the man in the middle determined the result  rather than the efforts of the players!  And that from a sort of neutral view! even if I have been a Kloppy fan for years!

[Marc]

The year is 2025 and Liverpool fans are still talking about Kane diving and Storts is still handing out L’s.

 

Good topic.