Coronavirus (COVID-19) Outbreak

[MUFC]

Great speech Boris. You can go outside, but you can’t go outside?

Also repeat 50 times – In the past 2 months.

[Carnivore Chris]

38 minutes ago, Stan said:

 

This gives me a lot of hope I may be able to see my missus soon...

A bit harsh on your married friends that you can only sit next to a single friend...

 

[Honey Honey]

I'd like to know what data suggests to relax lockdown in the North East?

Sunderland, Gateshead, Middlesbrough and South Tyneside have more cases per 100k population than anywhere else in England.

London was 2-4 weeks ahead of the North East so should relaxation be the same time?

Is it that cases and deaths in the last couple of weeks have been down to care homes and hospitals?

What is the R and new cases when excluding hospitals and care homes?

[RandoEFC+]

I have no idea I'm afraid chaps.

Good luck.

[Burning Gold]

1 hour ago, Stan said:

True, I guess it just adds to the lack of clarity. Perhaps the wording should have been 'household' and not just friends. Not everyone who lives in the same house is just family...

I find it ironic that they've said we need to 'control the virus', and while I appreciate all the new rules (from Weds) about going to parks/beaches etc still have the social distancing aspect in place too, it just heightens the risk for the virus to spread, I think. 

It goes back to @Danny's point earlier about putting the onus on the public. That should be the case anyway to an extent but at the same time, it needs clear messages from the government too.

Remember we're not talking about government communication here; it's a tweet from a news presenter. Although that actually reflects most of the problem in my opinion.

The guidance has been a lot clearer than it gets credit for (although far from perfect), but the delivery is incredibly confused. What we usually get is a handful of leaks to the press that attract little attention, followed by a detailed announcement and then the press go to work unpicking what the new legislation means for you.

What we're getting at the moment is leaks to the press that attract a lot of attention (because it's an incredibly important topic to everyone) followed by a weird, non-comprehensive summary from the PM then more leaks to the press. The detailed announcement will come on Wednesday, but by then the majority of people will have gone off half-cocked based on what they've understood from the various sources over the past few days, and will continue to behave in that manner going forward. To understand the restrictions, you have to wait until the law comes out on Wednesday and basically ignore the press and the PM until then. But how can you? This is about whether I can see my vulnerable dad, whether you can see your girlfriend (fiance?), whether Chris can work. It's about how we're combatting the most serious threat in most of our lifetimes. Of course we're eager to get the news as soon as we can, and any discrepancy between the first reports and the actual restrictions is going to cause confusion and have quite serious consequences.

The most disappointing part of all of this is that communication combined with behavioural science and focus groups is meant to be what this government does well. It's how they won the referendum (Take Back Control) and the election (Get Brexit Done), but they can't use it to protect us from the virus.

By the way, none of this excuses what some people are doing. Congas and sunbathing in the park and shit. At no point has it been said that you can do whatever you want as long as you stay 2m apart. These people are deliberately and knowingly flouting the rules and should be punished

Edited May 10, 2020 by Burning Gold

[Stan]

45 minutes ago, Burning Gold said:

Remember we're not talking about government communication here; it's a tweet from a news presenter. Although that actually reflects most of the problem in my opinion.

Nah I appreciate that. But this is from a government briefing to those journalists. As you say it's part of the problem regardless as stuff gets leaked so easily these days. So many moles around and that's not just indicative of government to be honest!

The messaging has been a lot clearer than it gets credit for (although far from perfect), but the delivery is incredibly confused. What we usually get is a handful of leaks to the press that attract little attention, followed by a detailed announcement and then the press go to work unpicking what the new legislation means for you.

What we're getting at the moment is leaks to the press that attract a lot of attention (because it's an incredibly important topic to everyone) followed by a weird, non-comprehensive summary from the PM then more leaks to the press. The detailed announcement will come on Wednesday, but by then the majority of people will have gone off half-cocked based on what they've understood from the various sources over the past few days, and will continue to behave in that manner going forward. To understand the restrictions, you have to wait until the law comes out on Wednesday and basically ignore the press and the PM until then. But how can you? This is about whether I can see my vulnerable dad, whether you can see your girlfriend (fiance?), whether Chris can work. It's about how we're combatting the most serious threat in most of our lifetimes. Of course we're eager to get the news as soon as we can, and any discrepancy between the first reports and the actual restrictions is going to cause confusion and have quite serious consequences.

I think the official announcements will be made tomorrow when Boris is back in parliament. There's a 60-page document outlining everything included in this 'roadmap' Boris mentioned in the speech today, also including the rules and new instructions announced today and for Wednesday onwards. Having said that, I agree about the 'half-cocked' thing partly because of all the looks and to some information being passed around like Chinese whispers about who can do what and when they can do it.

The most disappointing part of all of this is that communication combined with behavioural science and focus groups is meant to be what this government does well. It's how they won the referendum (Take Back Control) and the election (Get Brexit Done), but they can't use it to protect us from the virus.

I think again the media plays a huge part in that. A lot of it is a mix of government spin and media spin. Which one rules the other is another matter...

By the way, none of this excuses what some people are doing. Congas and sunbathing in the park and shit. At no point has it been said that you can do whatever you want as long as you stay 2m apart. These people are deliberately and knowingly flouting the rules and should be punished

Funny you say that...Sunbathing in the park is reportedly allowed from Wednesday! Congas should definitely not be on the fucking agenda, let alone in the middle of a global pandemic  

 

[carefreeluke]

58 minutes ago, Harvsky said:

I'd like to know what data suggests to relax lockdown in the North East?

Sunderland, Gateshead, Middlesbrough and South Tyneside have more cases per 100k population than anywhere else in England.

London was 2-4 weeks ahead of the North East so should relaxation be the same time?

Is it that cases and deaths in the last couple of weeks have been down to care homes and hospitals?

What is the R and new cases when excluding hospitals and care homes?

Who knows what’s the right way to do things but Spain’s done it by region. Some areas of the country are being allowed to move to the next phase whereas others are staying on phase 0, Madrid for example.

Was speaking to one friend yesterday here in the south of the country and she was talking about how one of her friends is having a party this week in a bar. Me personally I think I’ll be leaving social arrangements face to face for another 2-3 weeks at least. Not to be pessimistic but I think a lot of countries will be getting a second wave, just takes one person and you could be back to square one.

[Harry]

7 hours ago, Carnivore Chris said:

I've just realised now that I referred to "nursery"(or play-school, pre-school whatever else) as "kinder" while replying to @Harry. I don't think I've ever referred to it as that ever

You may have got that from me.

Here we call it kinder rather than pre school or kindergarten

[LFCMike]

 

 

[Stan]

24 minutes ago, LFCMike said:

 

 

Standard to expect now...

[Harry]

[DeadLinesman]

I’m just glad reception and year 1 (who have zero idea about distancing and no exams) can go back. Whilst my 7 year old and her mates who had Sats this year and can be reasoned with (just about) are left at home. For the record, I could send her in but choose not to anyway due to El Wifo being pregnant.

[Stan]

1 hour ago, DeadLinesman said:

I’m just glad reception and year 1 (who have zero idea about distancing and no exams) can go back. Whilst my 7 year old and her mates who had Sats this year and can be reasoned with (just about) are left at home. For the record, I could send her in but choose not to anyway due to El Wifo being pregnant.

[LFCMike]

 Maybe don't change the rules every time a government representative goes on the tele

[Danny]

5 minutes ago, LFCMike said:

 Maybe don't change the rules every time a government representative goes on the tele

I must have missed the part in the dictionary where stay alert didn’t mean stay alert but meant follow the rules...idiots

[Fairy In Boots]

I personally don’t think we locked down too early, the fatigue is showing now and people are breaking the rules at an increasing rate. Car traffic is much heavier and as they say we’re now past the peak it’s been timed right, if we’d have gone a fortnight earlier we’d have probably started breaking lockdown earlier and prolonged it in my opinion. I’ve been lucky enough to be a key worker working nationwide so I’ve worked throughout even had holidays cancelled for it. Motorways were fun the first couple of weeks did Scotland in record time. 

I’ve also stopped watching the questions part of the briefing and mainstream media analysis in general as it’s descended into ideological shit slinging now. 

One of the companies I’ve been supporting on the ventilator project is a team made up of virologist, medical scientists etc and they’re all pretty much saying comparison data at present from the media is just shite. 
 

Population density, ethnicity, temperature, obesity, age, health care system & recording system all are varying factors from country to country so it’s utter horse shit. They will direct from official papers and reports and that will take months. 

The death toll will be much higher than predicted however from not direct covid-19 but more the effect it has had on society. what I mean by that is that our success rates with cancer and other disease will be worse, I was talking to a senior consultant for A&E in London and she said that “where are they all? People aren’t visiting hospital” this will have a knock on effect as we have effectively had a 2 month holiday and this is life or death in diagnosing life threatening illness. 

Also finally James Dyson what a cunt, he didn’t get his ventilators because he’s a petulant little child, a real life bell end. The cunt spent the best part of a week delayed his whole project which was sound and had been worked out by proper medical scientist to try and get his “patented cyclone technology” intergrated. It’s cost him massively the silly cunt. 

 

On 08/05/2020 at 07:53, Harvsky said:

 

 

Whilst the clickbait quick opinions are laughter and head in hands because they've immediately assumed it is Daily Mail making shit up, the article itself is actually about academic research at the University of Reading. It is the academic trained in health discourse who makes the assumption that German media discourse is not in the same vein as the UK because of words coined during the Nazi period being a no go. As well as citing work by a German academic to support that claim.

Still, 19 likes for Reading University and the academic work versus 19000 likes for laughing at the Daily Mail.

I feel quite bad for the academic that her work is being taken to be laughed at.

It’s not lost on me that people most effected from this virus 50+ remember the tales told by their folks about the war and the “blitz spirit” is most embodied by them. 
 

[Harry]

5 minutes ago, Fairy In Boots said:

I personally don’t think we locked down too early, the fatigue is showing now and people are breaking the rules at an increasing rate. Car traffic is much heavier and as they say we’re now past the peak it’s been timed right, if we’d have gone a fortnight earlier we’d have probably started breaking lockdown earlier and prolonged it in my opinion. I’ve been lucky enough to be a key worker working nationwide so I’ve worked throughout even had holidays cancelled for it. Motorways were fun the first couple of weeks did Scotland in record time. 

I’ve also stopped watching the questions part of the briefing and mainstream media analysis in general as it’s descended into ideological shit slinging now. 

One of the companies I’ve been supporting on the ventilator project is a team made up of virologist, medical scientists etc and they’re all pretty much saying comparison data at present from the media is just shite. 
 

Population density, ethnicity, temperature, obesity, age, health care system & recording system all are varying factors from country to country so it’s utter horse shit. They will direct from official papers and reports and that will take months. 

The death toll will be much higher than predicted however from not direct covid-19 but more the effect it has had on society. what I mean by that is that our success rates with cancer and other disease will be worse, I was talking to a senior consultant for A&E in London and she said that “where are they all? People aren’t visiting hospital” this will have a knock on effect as we have effectively had a 2 month holiday and this is life or death in diagnosing life threatening illness. 

Also finally James Dyson what a cunt, he didn’t get his ventilators because he’s a petulant little child, a real life bell end. The cunt spent the best part of a week delayed his whole project which was sound and had been worked out by proper medical scientist to try and get his “patented cyclone technology” intergrated. It’s cost him massively the silly cunt. 

 

It’s not lost on me that people most effected from this virus 50+ remember the tales told by their folks about the war and the “blitz spirit” is most embodied by them. 
 

There's been a couple of decent articles in the Washington Post analysing the excess mortality rate. That being a measure of total deaths within the population above any typical/average pattern for the time of year. This would pick up that type of additional cause of death. 

https://www.washingtonpost.com/investigations/2020/05/02/excess-deaths-during-covid-19/?arc404=true

[Bluewolf]

I see they are now saying that they are going to make it mandatory for people to wear masks while travelling on any public transport and as we don't have enough PPE to go around you can do makeshift masks or use scarves to cover yourself with... I then read this bit which I found strange to say the least... 

"Although wearing a mask is unlikely to prevent you from getting the virus they could help prevent you from giving it to others" 

So if I am wearing a mask I can't give it to others and if they are wearing a mask they can't give it to me then how else would I pick it up??? through touch obviously, All them rails, and bars and seats and buttons being used and touched by hundreds of people every day.. how about asking people to wear gloves as well, might that not be a good idea?? 

[CaaC (John)+]

33 minutes ago, Bluewolf said:

I see they are now saying that they are going to make it mandatory for people to wear masks while travelling on any public transport and as we don't have enough PPE to go around you can do makeshift masks or use scarves to cover yourself with... I then read this bit which I found strange to say the least... 

"Although wearing a mask is unlikely to prevent you from getting the virus they could help prevent you from giving it to others" 

So if I am wearing a mask I can't give it to others and if they are wearing a mask they can't give it to me then how else would I pick it up??? through touch obviously, All them rails, and bars and seats and buttons being used and touched by hundreds of people every day.. how about asking people to wear gloves as well, might that not be a good idea?? 

I have noticed quite a few people wearing plastic gloves when shopping in Tesco's, it might end up everybody wearing spacesuits next as if we are shopping on the moon.

[Stan]

46 minutes ago, Bluewolf said:

I see they are now saying that they are going to make it mandatory for people to wear masks while travelling on any public transport and as we don't have enough PPE to go around you can do makeshift masks or use scarves to cover yourself with... I then read this bit which I found strange to say the least... 

"Although wearing a mask is unlikely to prevent you from getting the virus they could help prevent you from giving it to others" 

So if I am wearing a mask I can't give it to others and if they are wearing a mask they can't give it to me then how else would I pick it up??? through touch obviously, All them rails, and bars and seats and buttons being used and touched by hundreds of people every day.. how about asking people to wear gloves as well, might that not be a good idea?? 

I'm guessing because some makeshift masks that aren't PPE standard might be less useful in eliminating the threat of passing it on. 

Using hand-sanitiser has been the advice usually given out to help protect you from getting the virus ? At least it's another layer on the hands for the virus to get through?

[nudge+]

58 minutes ago, Bluewolf said:

I see they are now saying that they are going to make it mandatory for people to wear masks while travelling on any public transport and as we don't have enough PPE to go around you can do makeshift masks or use scarves to cover yourself with... I then read this bit which I found strange to say the least... 

"Although wearing a mask is unlikely to prevent you from getting the virus they could help prevent you from giving it to others" 

So if I am wearing a mask I can't give it to others and if they are wearing a mask they can't give it to me then how else would I pick it up??? through touch obviously, All them rails, and bars and seats and buttons being used and touched by hundreds of people every day.. how about asking people to wear gloves as well, might that not be a good idea?? 

Masks are mandatory here in public, and a lot of people also wear gloves too (so do I). It's an easy way to protect yourself and others with very little inconvenience. 

[CaaC (John)+]

At Tesco's here in Leith they have hand sanitizers as you walk into the shop, you squirt it on your hands then they have staff beside trolleys inside the store with gloves on and hand sanitizers they squirt on the hand trolley bars and wiping them down, a lot of people wearing masks and gloves but I noticed there are quite a few pricks who walk into the store not bothering with masks or gloves, they don't bother wiping their hands with the sanitisers or following the arrows around the aisles and not bothering to keep a distance away from shoppers

Fucking morons and as I have mentioned before they are the bastards who might get the virus and then scream blue murder and blame everybody under the sun except themselves, they should get people like these and put them into caves as they did in medieval times with lepers and warn people not to go near them.

[Carnivore Chris]

8 minutes ago, CaaC (John) said:

At Tesco's here in Leith they have hand sanitizers as you walk into the shop, you squirt it on your hands then they have staff beside trolleys inside the store with gloves on and hand sanitizers they squirt on the hand trolley bars and wiping them down, a lot of people wearing masks and gloves but I noticed there are quite a few pricks who walk into the store not bothering with masks or gloves, they don't bother wiping their hands with the sanitisers or following the arrows around the aisles and not bothering to keep a distance away from shoppers

Fucking morons and as I have mentioned before they are the bastards who might get the virus and then scream blue murder and blame everybody under the sun except themselves, they should get people like these and put them into caves as they did in medieval times with lepers and warn people not to go near them.

This is why I only go to booths now. It's simpler and easier.

I'd end up fighting in the likes of Asda, it's just not worth it mate. Booths is quieter and easy. Much better quality as well in fact, even if it is a bit more expensive.

 

 

[Bluebird Hewitt]

36 minutes ago, CaaC (John) said:

At Tesco's here in Leith they have hand sanitizers as you walk into the shop, you squirt it on your hands then they have staff beside trolleys inside the store with gloves on and hand sanitizers they squirt on the hand trolley bars and wiping them down, a lot of people wearing masks and gloves but I noticed there are quite a few pricks who walk into the store not bothering with masks or gloves, they don't bother wiping their hands with the sanitisers or following the arrows around the aisles and not bothering to keep a distance away from shoppers

Fucking morons and as I have mentioned before they are the bastards who might get the virus and then scream blue murder and blame everybody under the sun except themselves, they should get people like these and put them into caves as they did in medieval times with lepers and warn people not to go near them.

Bit like Carnivore Chris mentioned above, if I need to do shopping it's either the small Tesco Express or Nisa nearby. After hearing the abuse my sister has had from the thick fucking cunts (from what she said), I can't be arsed with any of the main stores. 

[Machado]